The Problem with Comics

[vartemis]

Originally Posted by DustinParker

I think there should be more then just accessible versions of current comic characters for kids. There should be comics for every reading level with content maturity ratings...and they should be affordable.

As far as I'm concerned, it's the independents time to shine. Especially in the age of the tablet. It's never cost less or been easier to create content for all ages. New/learning reader content doesn't even have to be long. Most children's books are 10-15 pages of single pictures.

If you take that one step further and make them interactive with sound effects, a voice that reads the story (now parents don't even have to) and when you touch a word it says/shows how to pronounce it.... potential is limitless.

The problem is that it costs a lot of money and/or time to create something like that. Who's going to narrate it? Who's going to create the sfx? How are you going to pay them? Are you going to create a stand alone app, or are you going to package it though something like Madefire? Right now studies have shown as of Jan 2012 only 19% of Amercan's own a tablet. That number gets smaller when you consider the fragmantation of OS and resolutions. How are you going to develop for them? There's a reason why companies like Comixology work so well, they are gatekeepers and have done the legwork. So you lose profit to them.

As well, how many parents would buy their kid a tablet, or let them use theirs and risk them breaking it? Only a select few. They may read it with them, but it's just easier to plop the kid down in front of the glowing babysitter and let them watch Dora and the like.

Finally, you are looking at price point. Most apps geared at younger audiences only succeed at 99 cents because the parent can justify the impulse buy. You can try and get them to spend more with in-app purchasing, say future titles, but I haven't seen a reading app that works well with in-app advertising, a key to making the loss leader profitable, as you need all the real estate you can to view the text.

[DustinParker]

Most of those things I could do myself and what I couldn't do I know people who can.. For everything else, yes it would cost money.

However, I do believe in the whole "no risk, no reward" thing.

That aside and more to the point about what I was getting at... While the comic model might be broken... The target audience aren't current readers.my point is to bring and grow comics into new medias/markets.

[Hanzou]

Your comments on the X-titles is spot on. I recently went to the comic store just to try to catch up with my favoritie title, and I was simply lost in a sea of X-titles. I literally had no idea which title to read, or where to spend my money. I could have purchased all the books, but I'm not spending 25-30 bucks on parts of stories. I tend to save that kind of money for graphic novels.

When I got into X-Men, there was only Uncanny X-Men. I could pick up that one book for a $1 and be pretty up to date on the entire X-verse. When the title split into Uncanny X-Men and X-Men, I was still okay because it was just two separate teams. If I wanted to catch up on the adventures of Wolverine and Gambit, I'd read X-Men. If I was interested in Storm's team, I would read Uncanny.

But now..... Now I have no clue wth is going on. It seems that the White Queen Cyclops, and Wolverine are in every single book. So I have no clue what's what. Also the art changes so rapidly from issue to issue that I just can't get into what's going on. Back in the 90s, you had creative teams having long tenures on books. Now it seems that every year or so, everything gets reset.

I now understand why so many kids just don't bother with American comics and just read manga. Want to jump into Naruto? Just pick up Naruto #1. The comic has had the same story and creative team since it began.

[Paul Sanderson]

I grew up in the 70s and 80s reading Batman comics (among MANY others) by the likes of O'Neil/Adams, Chua, Novick, Aparo, Englehart/Rogers, Wein etc. etc. I read those stories when I was very young and found them exciting, engaging, compelling. When I pick those same comics up today and read them as a 39 year old, I find them exciting, engaging, compelling. In other words, they were suited to all-ages. Not catered to kids or adults, no age in specific, but anyone of just about any age could get something out of those stories. Today's Batman comics...I wouldn't let any child near them. I'm not saying they're not good. Some of them are, but they're often very adult in nature and concept, and graphic in art, and you lose an entire generation of audience as a result. Even the so-called great Scott Snyder's (as some here on DW like to over-hype) Batman comics. They're aimed at adults, pure and simple, not at an all-ages grouping. And that's sad. Worse, it's criminal.

[Scribbly]

Originally Posted by Paul Sanderson

I grew up in the 70s and 80s reading Batman comics (among MANY others) by the likes of O'Neil/Adams, Chua, Novick, Aparo, Englehart/Rogers, Wein etc. etc. I read those stories when I was very young and found them exciting, engaging, compelling. When I pick those same comics up today and read them as a 39 year old, I find them exciting, engaging, compelling. In other words, they were suited to all-ages. Not catered to kids or adults, no age in specific, but anyone of just about any age could get something out of those stories. Today's Batman comics...I wouldn't let any child near them. I'm not saying they're not good. Some of them are, but they're often very adult in nature and concept, and graphic in art, and you lose an entire generation of audience as a result. Even the so-called great Scott Snyder's (as some here on DW like to over-hype) Batman comics. They're aimed at adults, pure and simple, not at an all-ages grouping. And that's sad. Worse, it's criminal.

Totally agree.
I was reading my comics in those days too.

In the 70’s and 80’s comics were sold in the old newsstand system, making them accessible to anyone.

From the end of the 80s and now on, comics are sold in comic’s shops through the direct market system,
Which was an invention of Phil Seuling for the benefit of Marvel and DC sales.
The truly story here,
http://classic.tcj.com/history/a-com...rket-part-one/

And this bold move changed forever the target audience of those publishing houses.
No that they weren’t selling enough.
Those years were of amazing top multimillionaire sales compared with their sales today.
The top high rank artists and writers where working for them those days.
They just wanted more.
They move out of the newsstand system, but this system still there, distributing magazines
to convenience stores, supermarkets and airports everyday, counting today.

The good news are that newsstands distribution is there still and indie publishers with professional level
of production can use those services.
For the same run print mandatory at Diamond, the newsstands distributors can put your book everywhere.
Returns? These can be sold online.

But is easier to criticize what combo meals Marvel or DC do, or don’t do
compared with what they used to do.
There are lot of meals that they are not doing and we can do.

[TimR]

Great comment, Paul Sanderson.

You write "Worse, it's criminal," which is an interesting way of looking at it, even if it is meant more rhetorically than literally. It's "criminal" that they've taken children's entertainment icons who entertained generations of children, and made them suitable only for adults. Put that way, maybe it's not too strong a word..

Scribbly - Thanks for that link, I will read that later.

I'm certainly one of those interested in pursuing newsstand distribution, but I'm not sure it's as easy as you make it sound.. even for "professional level" indie publishers. If it's so easy why aren't any of them taking advantage of it? Archie comics is in grocery stores and some newsstands still, but that's about it that I'm aware of...

[JonathanAMoore]

I've been saying it for years.

The two real problems:

1. Comics aren't suitable for children anymore
2. The comics shop. My parents bought a tremendous amount of comics for me in the 80s and early 90s off the spinner racks by the checkout at drug stores and grocery stores.

But by all means, comics world--greatly constrict your readership and availability.

[Lovecraft13]

Comic books don't feature comedians, and that's not funny.

[Sage]

Originally Posted by Lovecraft13

Comic books don't feature comedians, and that's not funny.

Truest - statement - EVER!

Seriously though the term comic-book is outdated, having been used to describe what comics used to be, which is collections of Newspaper comic strips. For people who grew up with comic-books it's easy to overlook the misnomer because we've always had comics in our lives. However, for mainstream audiences that have had little to no exposure to comics the name is somewhat of a detriment when marketing the material. A comic-book gives the impression that it's a humor book or a title meant for children, which leads to outrage when a parent buys a comic-book for their child and wouldn't you know it, there is Hank Pym emerging from his lovers vagina.

Graphic Novel is no better since it gives off the impression that there is adult content in the book. You see most associate the word graphic with adult themes, nudity, violence, gore, basically anything found in a Quentin Tarantino film and not graphic design or anything relating to the visual arts.

The term Manga roughly means comics or cartoons but the Japanese people have shown no resistance to the terminology and regularly buy Manga dealing with themes for all age groups. That unfortunately has not been the case here in America.

The comics industry for the longest time has 'not' been marketing its' material properly and for the most part, the Big 2, seem to show very little interest in ever doing so. People need to be shown that just because it says Comic-Book, not all of them are suited for kids and just because they're called Graphic Novels doesn't mean that it's for adults only.

So what's the solution? Ads? Commercials? Awareness programs? Rating system? Or do they simply change what they call themselves and market their material accordingly? What would you even call a Comic-Book or Graphic Novel if not that?

[vartemis]

The problem is that back when comics used to be targeted more to children, they were at a price point where children could afford to buy them. They are no longer at a price point that could be considered disposable, so the targeted market had to change. Not as many parents are willing to drop 3-5 bucks to shut their kids up for 15-20 minutes.

I dont think the floppies will ever be able to target kids as well as they used to. Digest will be the future of that demographic.

j

[New Way]

Originally Posted by Lovecraft13

Comic books don't feature comedians, and that's not funny.

Exactly, the title "comics" implies something funny which the vast majority of modern comics are not.

It's not that comics don't want new readers. The problem with comics today is the fact the major comic companies don't know how to target kids anymore. First of all When you hear people in the industry talk about targeting kids they almost always lump all kids together into one demographic regardless of age. Anyone who is familar with Children's liturature publication knows what we call "kid's books" are actually broken down into several subdemographics: toddlers(picture books), early readers, middle schoolers, and young adults. DC and Marvel have a line for early reader books(Johnny DC for example), but then their comics make the massive jump to adult comics and completely forget all those other demographics inbetween. Where is a child to go once he's outgrown Johnny DC?

[DomeSFX]

The problem with comics...exposure. Most of the companies cannot afford to advertise on website, radio, or tv. Only companies like Marvel and DC can do that. Moreover, most of the companies like Marvel and DC have sold their rights to other companies like Warner Brothers and Disney to help them get exposure.

Yes, we are having a reader decline, but why are we having reader decline?...because we are not longer getting exposure we got 20 years ago. Not getting publish or hired has little to do with why the comicbook market is failing. I actually talk to the fans themselves and from I get from them is the fact that most of them don't know anything outside of Marvel and DC.

[Sage]

Originally Posted by DomeSFX

The problem with comics...exposure. Most of the companies cannot afford to advertise on website, radio, or tv. Only companies like Marvel and DC can do that. Moreover, most of the companies like Marvel and DC have sold their rights to other companies like Warner Brothers and Disney to help them get exposure.

Yes, we are having a read decline, but why are we having reader decline...because we are not longer getting exposure we got 20 years ago. Not getting publish or hired has little to do with why the comicbook market is failing. I actually talk to the fans themselves and from I get from them is the fact that most of them don't know anything outside of Marvel and DC.

I'm sure it doesn't help that pretty much every comics news website only seems to cover Marvel & DC with any kind of authority. Fresh Ink Online covers more quality comics in 1 episode then Newsarama or Comicsalliance do in a year.

I guess making lists about the 10 Worst Avengers Members ever or the Best Cosplay (This Week) are more important than writing articles about good comic-books people should be buying.

[DomeSFX]

Originally Posted by Sage

I'm sure it doesn't help that pretty much every comics news website only seems to cover Marvel & DC with any kind of authority. Fresh Ink Online covers more quality comics in 1 episode then Newsarama or Comicsalliance do in a year.

I guess making lists about the 10 Worst Avengers Members ever or the Best Cosplay (This Week) are more important than writing articles about good comic-books people should be buying.

THANK YOU!!! That's exactly my point. That's why so many great comics go under the radar.

In this market, you have to be an idiot right now to start your own comic company when you have no money to commercialize your comics. Driving around and making your own comic cost money you don't have and it's limited exposure. The only way to get a regular fanbase would be to sell to same people you know. Sadly, you would have to high price your comics just to make up for the gas, production cost, and paying for material/team.