Balloonist question

[dead_cowboy]

Hey everyone,
I'll be lettering my own project soon (written by me, drawn by Lou Manna, thanks to a contact from Greg Scott). I'm not terribly experienced with Illustrator, though I'm more than willing to learn. I saw Balloonist and messed around with the demo a bit. Those wondering what the hell I'm talking about can check it out here. (www.smithandtinkers.com/balloonist/index.html)

Outside of loading art over a particular size, it seems to work pretty well. Can anyone give me a good reason why I should avoid this and just go with Illustrator (outside of it just being a good idea to learn Illustrator in general)? I'm talking about actual reasons that will affect the quality of my book, not just that it's a program for newbies that everyone makes fun of for having fewer options than Illustrator.

[Jason Arthur]

looks pretty snazzy actually.

Questions you should seek answers to though:

Can you make your tails curve?
Can you butt balloons to the edge of a panel?
Can you manipulate sound effects/text point-by-point?
Does this export as a vector format?
Can I outline my text so that I do not have to send copywritten font files to the printer?

There's plenty more you should ask, but if any of those can not be satisfied then it's not worth the $30 bucks.

-- J

[Kep!]

You said it yourself, quality. Balloonist is a nice tool for someone who doesn't want a crappy looking product, but it doesn't come close to making your product look professional. If you're serious about your work, why would you do anything byt give it the best possible presentation?

With that said, unless you have a couple of years under your belt, or that's how long it'll be until the book comes out and you can practice a lot, I'd reccomend attaining the services of a letterer who actually knows how to do the job. If you are NOT willing to do that, then you will be better off with Balloonist as it will do a better job than someone not skilled as a letterer.

Does that help?

[dead_cowboy]

>Can you make your tails curve?

No, but you can manipulate them in several other ways. They're not static.

>Can you butt balloons to the edge of a panel?

Yes, and you can group them.

>Can you manipulate sound effects/text point-by-point?

Not to the degree you're talking about.

>Does this export as a vector format?

Yes, I believe so.

>Can I outline my text so that I do not have to send copywritten font files to the printer?

You'll have to explain that one to me.

Anyway, Kep, this is Kurt from the comic section Cinescape.com. I reviewed the Ted Noodleman trade a long time ago for you. I thought I'd identify myself. The problem I'm faced with (besides not wanting to pay a letterer) is that I want to be able to revise the dialogue as I go along and have total control over it. My scripts aren't "done" until I see how the text looks on paper. I realize that may be nitpicky and will take more time, but I'm willing to give that. And, while I certainly want my book to look professional, I'm not sure if blundering through Illustrator would be the lesser of two evils or not.

Any other thoughts?

[Kep!]

Hey Kurt! Good to have you here, welcome to the letterer's haven from all the evils of the Internet. Heh.

Actually, your reasoning is the very reason I learned to letter in the first place...I rewrite on the fly. I can't speak to Balloonist's interface for that, but I can speak to Illustrators, which I like.

For me, it's about control. I like to have a LOT of it. Illustrator allows that. Looking at the samples online, it is for good, basic lettering. You're not going to do fantastic SFXs or hand kern and tweak like a fiend. BUT, you will be able to get a somewhat acceptable product a lot faster with Balloonist than with Illustrator if only for the learning curve.

Personally, i'd love to have a copy of it to play with and I think they're on to something...but what I see here, they're not there yet. Another year or two though and I expect I'll be hearing a lot more about this if they keep up on development.

SO! Since you're not keen on paying a letterer (sniff), but you are keen on trying this out, i say give it a shot and post up some pages for all of us to see...I'd love to get a first hand look of the product on real pages.

[dead_cowboy]

That's the other thing -- time. Personally -- not to make excuses or anything, but to give you insight -- I budget my time pretty tightly and I usually have 8,000 things going on at once. I have three seperate ongoing writing projects, a day job, and a monthly DJ spot at a local place. On top of that, I'm married and have a mortgage and all the attendant bullshit. In between all that, I have to find time to read other people's stuff, do all the normal life things, and get hammered with my friends, occasionally. Seriously, time means as much or more to me than my paycheck (though I'm fond of that).

So, for the benefit of the curious and my own sanity, I may just try Balloonist. For my first book, it'll probably get the job done. And, if I fail miserably, at least I can tell everyone not to use it. :slap:

[Kel Nuttall]

The straight tails alone make me want to tell you to stay the hell away from that program. Hell, just the fact that they don't use industry standard terminology makes it seem...iffy. Stems? STEMS?!? They're called tails. ;)

If you're putting all this valuable time and money into a "first book" why half-ass it at the end? Crap lettering can torpedo a decent book.

[cyxodus]

The name alone disqualifies it. Besides producing a quality that is way below pro standard, it only exports PDF, SVG and PNG. No TIFF and no EPS. That right there shoots it down.

Frankly, you use whatever you want but if you use this program, you'll be the William Hung of comic lettering.

[Jason Arthur]

The name alone disqualifies it. Besides producing a quality that is way below pro standard, it only exports PDF, SVG and PNG. No TIFF and no EPS. That right there shoots it down.

Frankly, you use whatever you want but if you use this program, you'll be the William Hung of comic lettering.

SHE-BANG!

-- J

[cyxodus]

BOOK GO BANG!

[cyxodus]

Kurt...I just finished using the balloonist and you've got to be kidding me. You honestly think that it can produce anything close to what you see from DC, Marvel or Image with this software!?

[Kep!]

Kurt...I just finished using the balloonist and you've got to be kidding me. You honestly think that it can produce anything close to what you see from DC, Marvel or Image with this software!?
Let's see your page. You're a letterer who knows how to place and such, let's see what it looks like.

[cyxodus]

This program may look good to a novice but it's a piece of junk.

First, it places the artwork in "Frames" instead of allowing you to place a background image. To get it to work, I had to delete all but 1 frame and then place the artwork inside of that frame. Second, working with balloons is a nightmare and didn't give me the results I was looking for. I couldn't move the blasted tail for anything. Third, the way it handles the text is horrible. You can't adjust the kerning, leading or the spacing and I couldn't get it to bold anything.

Here's the result and don't be fooled by the outcome. To even get it this far, I had to export it as a PDF, import it into Illustrator and export it as a JPEG. When I tried to export it as a PNG, the art was missing.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v238/cyxodus/DW%20Activities/ballonist_test.jpg

[dead_cowboy]

You can move the tale by pointing at the very tip of it. You can bold the text under one of the menu options. But, it's interface is wanting, to be sure.

You're correct about not being able to load background art. That's annoying and it threw me off when I first messed with it.

[Kep!]

Definately too mechanical for my tastes, but again, for a quick fix on a budget (or no budget) this might be a solution. I'll have to try it next lull I have.

[cyxodus]

I would go with Inkscape (http://www.inkscape.org/) instead.

http://inkscape.osuosl.org/screenshots/gallery/inkscape-0.44-clipandmask.png

[Jason Arthur]

that looks pretty nifty.

You might also wanna spend an extra $170 bucks or so and get Adobe Illustrator 9 or 10 on eBay. I think you can handle pretty much everything you need with 9, but I'd get 10 if you can find it reasonable.

best,

-- J

[cyxodus]

I agree but Inkscape is the best for those who can't spend the money.

[dead_cowboy]

I have a copy of Illustrator CS available. The issue is the learning curve and if the book will look better coming from a beginner's work on Illustrator versus using Balloonist.

[Amadarwin]

there are quite a few lettering tutorials for Illustrator out there, so the learning curve isn't that steep compared to the other programs listed, I'd think...

[cyxodus]

For starters, drop by my site (www.ninjalettering.com) and take a look at all the tutorials.