No such thing as a free ride

[drizzt2k]

I wanted to throw an idea out there and get some feed back and be mean.

This story will take place in the future and out in space. One of earth’s ships is transporting a battalion of marines when it is hit by something that transforms most of the crew and the marines into mindless monsters that only want to ingest anything living. It becomes a fight for survival for the few remaining and it will ultimately end in death for every one but it will be a fun and suspenseful ride before that happens. If people like it I will continue the story with the ship crashing into an inhabited planet where the people who live there will have to fight for there lives.

Like I said before, be mean.

[Scribe]

It seems like a sort typical post-Aliens story idea.

[JonHParrish]

I have to agree with Scribe. Overall this sounds like an Alien type of story. However, I think that if you add some sort of interesting twist or do something out of the ordinary with it, it would take it from being something normal and turn it into something unique.

[Awesomus Prime]

It is a little same ol'same ol' but I'd definitely read AND enjoy the one-shot. I think I'd be wary of buying a sequel for fear of let down.

[The Anti-crest]

Generic, and marines are boat oriented, on a space ship they would be Air Force, wouldnt they?

[JonHParrish]

Yeah, but in the movies. It's always Marines.

[The Anti-crest]

havent paid that much attention to the movies really.

[Awesomus Prime]

Space is for some reason Navel... unless starfighters get involved.

[xtylerx]

If I'm not mistaken...isn't this the premise for DOOM?

[Romaine]

George Romero called. He wants his plot back.

~Max Romaine

[JonHParrish]

Damn. You guys are pretty harsh. :confused:

Constructive criticism people. :yawn:

[Awesomus Prime]

Well...

A: You said be mean.

and

B: There's not _so_ much to go on.


It's essentially zombies in space, and as was said if you can make it special somehow people will want to read more. As it stands I'd read and enjoy the one shot but I doubt I'd buy a follow up.

I can think of some things that would make it special but then it would be MY story.

[JonHParrish]

I'm not the writer.

[Awesomus Prime]

lol... Sorry I just noticed that.

[xtylerx]

Damn. You guys are pretty harsh. :confused:

Constructive criticism people. :yawn:

No, I'm not trying to be a dick! I'm serious, I think this is the premise for Doom, or maybe it's Quake...I remember playing the demo for the new Quake game, and part of the plot is that you get partially converted to this mindless robo-alien-monster thing.

Aside from that, I think the writer could throw some more creative plot elements into the mix. Truthfully, I find it a little too reminiscent of a number of video game plots. That's all.

[Comix Obsession]

I think the most important thing is do you, as the creator, love it enough? If you're not writing it, who is, and do they love it so much that we are gonna see it in the writing?

In the end, that's what writing should be about - we'll criticise it when we can actually see what it's like.

[JonHParrish]

I agree. I want to see how the events take place. How characters react. We can sit here all day and criticize an idea, but if you put up a script and it's really good, then that will be that.

[Scribe]

Look its not about being harsh, its about being honest, and I've seen this story before, Aliens, Quake, Doom, Leviaton, Star Trek First Contact. That being said it doesn't mean tha you can't do something good with it, it's just that the basic idea, as you've presented it to us, is a little tired.

If you really want to do nasty aleins/robots/zombies tearing people up they fine, just find a way to do it so that it represents something that only you can bring to the table. None of us are trying to be mean, just honest.

[Comix Obsession]

I gotta agree with Scribe though, it isn't an original premise. But, like I say, it's not about that so much. You're working based on a well worn formula, if your writer is good - he or she can take that formula and play with the ingredients - that'll be a fun challenge to take on.

It's all about love of the story in the end - sometimes you can hit upon something within a familiar storyline that nobody has used before and then it becomes something great.

The only reason I'm not jumping on the idea you wrote down is because you said that you aren't the writer, and also because it's just a quick description of a story. So have faith in yourself, take on board what everyone said and get that thing written - and make it damn good! :nyah:

It's late, and I'm dangerously close to ranting on about something I don't do myself - writing, so I'll leave it at that.

Good luck!

David :cool:

[JonHParrish]

Just for future reference. I'm not the writer. I just want to make sure everyone knows. I just said that because some of the crits were just "Well, this sounds dull" but with no real feedback on how to improve it. I have no problem with people being critical and honest. I just have a problem with someone putting down someone else's idea with no rhyme or reason as to why.

[Lynn Lefey]

First off, Marines are used, because even while starships are frequently considered naval stuff, even if it were Air Force, people who get off 'the boat' and fight are marines. Air Force has a very small force of small arms combatants. Forward Air Controllers ar ekind of Air Force special forces that do land stuff. If you're talking about dropping first wave combattants onto a ball of dirt though, it'd be marines (or special forces for covert ops).

Is it original? No. Does it have potential? Yes, as has been demonstrated by the fact that it's been done before several times. I'd throw Reavers from Serenity/Firefly into this mix, sounding even more like what was described. Also Resident Evil (except that it was a complex, not a ship; not a big difference), maybe 28 Days Later (and pretty much any modern zombie movie).

I guess the question is how is this story different? What makes it unique?

[drizzt2k]

I did say be mean and this is what I wanted. I do understand how the over all summery can come off like another doom or aliens, but the real goal is to have what Lynn Lefey said, a modern zombie story. My angle on it is there wouldn’t be a main hero but the marines would have to work as a team to get through there problems. I am a big Romero fan and that would be the direction I was headed for but with details of the military that I would put in there for authenticity.

The underlining message is marines do not get along with sailors on ship. I’m placing the story in space because I think it will ultimately make the story more interesting, but if there is any question of service marines would be the ones on space ships because if were landing they are the first to touch ground.

I can’t thank every one enough for looking at my idea and giving feedback. I’m going to put a little of the story on paper and see what they think. Thanks again and I like the idea of star fighters.

:banana:

[Romaine]

It wasn't my intention to be rude or harsh, but he said "be mean," and frankly the plot sounded much like every other zombie story I've ever experienced. So I thought, "What would be a concise and humorous way to convey my opinion here?" :har:

But seriously, if zombies are really your thing, by all means, go for it. Just don't expect kudos for originality which, in my humble opinion, is half the substance of a good story. "Night Of The Living Dead" is forty-two years old. If you're going to do what's been done a hundred times before, it had better be some truly impressive work.

And no offense, but with this sort of thing, it usually isn't. But I wish you good fortune with your project.

"To thine own self be true."

~Max Romaine

[Eric Palicki]

For the record...there is no such thing as an 'original' zombie story. Or at least, it's nigh-impossible to write one. The best zombie stories - Dawn of the Dead; Walking Dead; 28 Days Later - aren't about zombies. They're about people. If you populate your story with interesting characters and give them something to do, the rest really doesn't matter...

On the other hand, if you populate your story with cliches, then all the fancy window dressing in the universe won't save it.

Bottom line, if the characters are convincing, we'll follow them anywhere.

Keep working!

[Romaine]

For the record...there is no such thing as an 'original' zombie story.

Precisely the point, and I think people should bloody well write something else.

If you populate your story with interesting characters and give them something to do, the rest really doesn't matter...

I must disagree here. Character development is generally the single most important element in storytelling, but by no means the only one. Good writers will let other story elements affect the development of their characters, and so setting, time, antagonist, etc., all are potentially every bit as important as the characters themselves. You can have great character development, but it'll be hard to enjoy it if the rest of the story is poorly constructed.

The best zombie stories - Dawn of the Dead; Walking Dead; 28 Days Later - aren't about zombies. They're about people.

I'm sorry and I'm not trying to be a jerk, but this actually made me laugh out loud.
Don't get me wrong. I love Romero, too. But are you kidding me? Folks, if it's great character development you're after, there's a hell of a lot better films out there than "Living Dead" and it's offspring. If this is what you love, then by all means, immerse yourself in it to your heart's desire. But check your movie collection. I'm willing to bet it's ninety-percent horror and action.

Don't try to tell me you're in it for good stories about people. Take away the zombies and you'd be bored out of your mind.

~Max Romaine

[Romaine]

And by the way...

...if you populate your story with cliches, then all the fancy window dressing in the universe won't save it.

:huh:

Flesh-Eating Zombie Tale = Cliche'

~Max Romaine

[Eric Palicki]

I must disagree here. Character development is generally the single most important element in storytelling, but by no means the only one. Good writers will let other story elements affect the development of their characters, and so setting, time, antagonist, etc., all are potentially every bit as important as the characters themselves. You can have great character development, but it'll be hard to enjoy it if the rest of the story is poorly constructed.

We'll agree to disagree, then. Perhaps it's just my opinion, but it is one that I've heard repeated at every writing seminar and in every book on craft I've ever experienced:

"Story grows out of character."

I never said that character alone was enough. You've got to give them something to do. Hence, the setting, time, antagonist (who is, in fact, a character). There has to be a plot, or else it's not a story, by definition, but the plot should grow out of the characters responses to the environment, and in the process, the character should OUTSHINE everything else.


I'm sorry and I'm not trying to be a jerk, but this actually made me laugh out loud.
Don't get me wrong. I love Romero, too. But are you kidding me? Folks, if it's great character development you're after, there's a hell of a lot better films out there than "Living Dead" and it's offspring. If this is what you love, then by all means, immerse yourself in it to your heart's desire. But check your movie collection. I'm willing to bet it's ninety-percent horror and action.

Who said anything about Romero? I did mention DAWN (and it's my fault for not clarifying) but I was referring, specifically, to the remake, which improves substantially on the characterization and character development of the original. And THE WALKING DEAD stands among the best examples of clearly and cleverly realized characters and their development in contemporary comics.

But check your movie collection. I'm willing to bet it's ninety-percent horror and action.

Now, this is the point at which I wonder if you really are trying to be a jerk. I mention three quality examples from the hundreds (thousands) of zombie stories, and it leads you to make incredibly broad generalizations about my tastes. I'll agree with you that most zombie stories (and most outer space stories...and most vampire stories...and so on) are cliched dreck, but the point I am trying to make, and which you seem deadset against simply because you don't like zombies, is that the capacity for quality storytelling exists in any medium, in any genre. And character is key.

So as not to start a flame war, I invite you to continue this discussion with my via PM or email (epalicki@gmail.com), but I thank you not to make broad and baseless generalizations about me or anyone else on these boards.

And, by the way, I'll take that bet. Not much horror or action here, at all, unless you consider Kurosawa to be an action director.

Don't try to tell me you're in it for good stories about people. Take away the zombies and you'd be bored out of your mind.

That is a ridiculous thing to say. I hate zombies. I absolutely hate them. But I can still find a handful of diamonds in the rough. I wonder if you can't see the forest for the undead trees...

[Eric Palicki]

And by the way...



:huh:

Flesh-Eating Zombie Tale = Cliche'

~Max Romaine

Maybe I should've been clearer: I was talking specifically about character, which I thought would be evident from the bulk of the post (a post which, by the way, was not for your benefit). Unique and original characters can go a long way toward fixing a cliched or damaged plot.