Symmetrical?

[Ron Phillips]

When you guys make balloons. Do they have to be symmetrical? And if so, how do you do it?

I was putting up a temp page for Nate Lovett, and the balloon I made looks off.

http://natelovett.com

[Piekos]

There's no set answer for that one. Depends what you're end goal is. In general, yes they should be symetrical. When I letter things for Mike Allred, I purposefully make the balloons a little less symetrical because it compliments the "organicness" of his inks.

That balloon isn't very off, though. Just a hair.

~N

[Ron Phillips]

Thanks Nate. How do you make the anchor points even to make it symmetrical?

Not the best use of your Street Cred. :rolleyes:

[Ron Phillips]

I updated it a bit. After I did it, I thought I probably could have padded the border around the "NateLovett.com" a bit more and brought it down more into the first balloon. Posted the image so you didn't have to jump over.

http://natelovett.com/images/graphics/natelovett-temp.jpg

[Kel Nuttall]

Ron, I think this is what you're looking for....

http://www.balloontales.com/tips/tvshape/index.html

[Ron Phillips]

Ron, I think this is what you're looking for....

http://www.balloontales.com/tips/tvshape/index.html

That's exactly what I was looking for. I was using the pen tool and pulling anchors, man that was so much fun. :) Of course my knowledge of illustrator is limited.

Thanks!

[Clem Robins]

i work from a series of template balloons, each configured to accommodate stacked text of different shapes.

each of these was made to be slightly asymmetrical. they're all slightly skewed and a little wobbly.

in using them, i usually drag the nodes around a little bit to make them still less symmetrical. this is particularly helpful if your block of text is left- or right-ragged.

it's all part of trying to make the product look handmade. i believe this is preferable, because the drawings themselves are handmade. mechanical perfection is the enemy.

[Kep!]

What he said. Except I don't do that.

I work from a template where the balloons are symetrical (Ron, call me if you want a simple way to make them) but I have several that I use to accomodate the text. I'm all for the hand-lettered look, but I also like the Illustrator lettered look as long as it isn't so mechanical it looks done by BRAINIAC.

It's a very tough line to walk and in the end it just needs to be something you're happy with. If you want to get REALLY anal, flip through the archives of this forum and you'll find a couple of different techniques for making the strokes on the balloon vary in width to make them look more handlettered as well. Looks GREAT, but it then begs the question: "if you want it to look hand lettered, shouldn't you letter by hand?". This debate has at least another decade in it, but for now there's no pat answer.

[Clem Robins]

"flip through the archives of this forum and you'll find a couple of different techniques for making the strokes on the balloon vary in width to make them look more handlettered as well."

can you tell me where these techniques are, kep? i would like to try that.

to reiterate, my own rationale for making things look handmade isn't out of blind loyalty to the past, but because i think it looks less obtrusive, and more fun, on top of drawings which are also handmade.

by the way, you made a common error in your use of the phrase "begs the question". actually, this term doesn't mean what most people think it means. "Begs the question" means that a circular argument has been made, using an unproven point to prove that point. check the following link:

http://begthequestion.info/

i wouldn't pin you down on this normally. but the correct usage of this phrase is so incredibly useful, i think an articulate guy like you deserves to have it in his verbal arsenal.

again, if you could point me to one of those techniques you mentioned, i would be eternally in your debt. thanks, kep.

[Piekos]

I also think American letterers could get a little more creative with the shape of the balloons. I've been using manga-inspired balloon shapes in my own strip and elsewhere and that's working out well. I use that calligraphic stroke technique when I'm placing balloons over art that's been inked with a brush. It's a nice compliment.

Come on now, Clem...if you're going to get on poor Kep about proper language, you're going to have to go back through your posts and use capital letters at the beginning of every sentence!

:laugh:

~N

[Clem Robins]

you're right, of course. i am a big hypocrite, and am proud of it.

but the proper use of "begging the question" is a personal crusade of mine, along with the correct usage of the two very different terms "every day" and "everyday".

[Amadarwin]

That begs the question of the proper uses of 'every day' and 'everyday' then.

:har:

[Gonzogoose]

And anymore and any more while you're at it. :har:

Seriously though, some interesting info here. Cool.

[Kep!]

can you tell me where these techniques are, kep? i would like to try that.


If I can't find it I'll rewrite it myself, it really is a nifty couple of tricks to have handy.

by the way, you made a common error in your use of the phrase "begs the question". actually, this term doesn't mean what most people think it means. "Begs the question" means that a circular argument has been made, using an unproven point to prove that point. check the following link:

http://begthequestion.info/

i wouldn't pin you down on this normally. but the correct usage of this phrase is so incredibly useful, i think an articulate guy like you deserves to have it in his verbal arsenal.


HA! I do like that, thank you kindly.

[Piekos]

I think I've mentioned this before, but if you're REALLY into good grammar and composition, there's one book above all others that I'd recommend: Strunk and White's THE ELEMENTS OF STYLE. You can find it at any book store for less than 10 bucks. The most useful 80 (or so) pages you may ever read on the subject.

~N

[Kep!]

I think I've mentioned this before, but if you're REALLY into good grammar and composition, there's one book above all others that I'd recommend: Strunk and White's THE ELEMENTS OF STYLE. You can find it at any book store for less than 10 bucks. The most useful 80 (or so) pages you may ever read on the subject.

~N
I get teased a lot about this, but I really do carry a copy of this with me in my coat almost wherever i am. It's great reading in long lines.

[Clem Robins]

And anymore and any more while you're at it. :har:

Seriously though, some interesting info here. Cool.

i don't know all the grammatical terms for the distinction. i should probably call my 8th grade English teacher. but…

"every day" is an adjective phrase. it is almost always correct. "I letter comics every day."

"everyday" is an adjective. "Lettering comics is an everyday occurrence at my studio."

in 1972, Jacklyn Smith did a Breck commercial, and she said, "It's gentle enough to use every day." But she ran the two words together, pronouncing them as "everyday", which would be incorrect. i honestly think the error began with this commercial. the next time i see her, i will probably punch her in the nose.

[cyxodus]

Masher!! Masher!!

[Comics Commando]

but the proper use of "begging the question" is a personal crusade of mine, along with the correct usage of the two very different terms "every day" and "everyday".>>

-------------------

Man, Clem, I knew we cut from the same cloth from our correspondence--what was it?--yesterday? When we discussed latin root words.

These are clearly two different terms ("every" is an adjective, "day" is a noun, and "everyday" is another adjective), that seem to be transposed willy-nilly for no apparent reason other than the user failed to complete 8th grade english class.

Another that bugs me is "that" vs."who"...a person is a who--a thing is a that...no such thing as "a friend that reads comics". And don't get me started on the almost-always misuse of the word "only". I still see it misused in respectable publications.

And, yes, Nate (go, RISD-!) is correct about the Elements of Style book--it's where I learned how to be anal about all of this ages ago when I started lettering and thought it would aid me in letters and writing.

But about organic balloons--funny how we all use this infernal computerized machine to make something look as if it were created with human hands. I know I try to emulate the stroke of a speedball (that's a pen, not a high) or crowquill when creating copy lettering fonts. I hand lettered for years and know how different the line looks when the pen is dragged in defferent directions. I hunched so low over my drawing board I have the posture of a broiled shrimp!

Kurt Hathaway
Comics Commando
Cartoon Balloons Studios

[Comics Commando]

I swear I hadn't already read Clem's reference to 8th grade when I referred to it!

Separated at Birth?

Kurt Hathaway

[Clem Robins]

i'm certain we were separated at birth, even though i am probably ten or twelve years older than you are. i know a surgeon who could reunite us, if you're interested