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kevinharte36
08-28-2017, 01:16 PM
Still working on these. Spent too long on these pages, still need to render them.

http://i67.tinypic.com/903ude.png
http://i68.tinypic.com/34r856g.png
http://i63.tinypic.com/nh1cvp.png
http://i68.tinypic.com/nzizir.png
http://i66.tinypic.com/iom1rd.png
http://i64.tinypic.com/28mnxn8.png

kevinharte36
08-28-2017, 01:41 PM
Smaller size...

https://preview.ibb.co/cGPrBk/1.png (https://ibb.co/ksef45)
https://preview.ibb.co/hr5L45/2.png (https://ibb.co/fBnpxQ)
https://preview.ibb.co/e2B4Wk/3.png (https://ibb.co/gandrk)
https://preview.ibb.co/egoZE5/4.png (https://ibb.co/ivRMu5)
https://preview.ibb.co/dm6AnQ/5.png (https://ibb.co/eRQgu5)
https://preview.ibb.co/c63O7Q/6.png (https://ibb.co/jZaEE5)

Orlan29
08-28-2017, 02:27 PM
This is all digital? very nice for coloring is this why it is only line art?

Orlando

Orlan29
08-28-2017, 02:29 PM
Awesome but too mid-shots the first page is awesome with the background

Orlan29
08-28-2017, 02:39 PM
I think this is very good if done in digital good line control but page two is in need for panel two needs a bit adjustment on girl's face and hands.

Orlando

kevinharte36
08-28-2017, 03:15 PM
Thanks:) I did everything on paper first, scanned it in, wasn't happy with the line quality. I then just used manga studio for the first time and drew on my UGEE 1910b, over and over again. Meant to try and get it done at a page a day, but been nearly a month now.

Still going to add the blacks / shading to it. Still learning

Neil Allen
09-02-2017, 06:00 AM
A couple points of criticism:

Some of the faces look pretty strange. The most notable are those two girls on page two. Their expressions seem so pronounced that it looks like a parody to me. I'm not sure if that look is intentional or not. If the girls have been joker gassed or something, then it's okay.

Also, the scene with the horses and carriages... It looks like you copied and pasted the same image over and over again, and it looks really unnatural, in my opinion. If those are meant to represent real horses (and not statues or something), I don't believe they would be standing so uniformly. I'd draw one with its head down, one looking another way, or something like that.

kevinharte36
09-02-2017, 03:17 PM
Neil, I find your criticisms very odd. You generally seem very strict on what needs fixing then at the end of it your post links to your work and it's mainly done with crayons and has alot of room for improvement.

That being said thanks, I'll work on my head constructions.

sevans
09-02-2017, 08:09 PM
Wow..... have to say Kevinharte36, that whether you like Neil's artwork or not, that his crits are still valid. If you haven't noticed, alot of people have left comments on his work too.

Keep it civil and adult. A good crit is still valid whoever posts it.

12013
09-02-2017, 10:12 PM
Neil, I find your criticisms very odd. You generally seem very strict on what needs fixing then at the end of it your post links to your work and it's mainly done with crayons and has alot of room for improvement.

That being said thanks, I'll work on my head constructions.

jeez. super douche response...the whole "i think my arts better than yours therefore any critiques you make are invalid. because I'm better than you".

a person can have zero drawing ability and still offer up thoughts and insight. stuff you should pay attention to.
I thought the critique offered up was nicely put and very accurate. it wasn't a tear down of you personally or your skills or your work as a whole. it offered some thoughts you should listen to, and you come back with "I draw better than you, so you don't know what you are talking about."

says more about you than anything else.

so..as for my thoughts...
the first thing I noticed was the perspective on that arch in the background is WAY off. how can you not see that?

I like the characters and their period specific clothing.
everything is pretty clean and clear, tho I don't personally like art like this without any rendering, but that's totally a preference.
yes..some faces look kinda weird.
I don't like the obvious all-digital looking nature of all this. again, that's just me.

so..thats my thoughts...
oh..and my art.. here..https://robnor101.deviantart.com/
in case you want to tell me my opinions aren't valid because you are a better artist.

MattTriano
09-02-2017, 11:01 PM
Neil, I find your criticisms very odd. You generally seem very strict on what needs fixing then at the end of it your post links to your work and it's mainly done with crayons and has alot of room for improvement.

That being said thanks, I'll work on my head constructions.

Your pages are grim, your faces are indeed wonky as shit, and your attitude is akin to that of a child.

kevinharte36
09-03-2017, 05:56 AM
@sevans Will do.
@12013 No problem thanks for the feedback.
@MattTriano Yeah ok. Grim I don't agree with as I haven't set the mood yet with the rendering. If I used alot of shadow/blacks with the final rendering that would set the mood. Your work on the other hand on your tumblr has a very heavy use of shadows which one could also say is grim because it's mostly dark/overcast.

kevinharte36
09-03-2017, 10:53 AM
https://preview.ibb.co/bHzYWv/7.png (https://ibb.co/hg40Bv)

MattTriano
09-03-2017, 04:54 PM
@sevans Will do.
@12013 No problem thanks for the feedback.
@MattTriano Yeah ok. Grim I don't agree with as I haven't set the mood yet with the rendering. If I used alot of shadow/blacks with the final rendering that would set the mood. Your work on the other hand on your tumblr has a very heavy use of shadows which one could also say is grim because it's mostly dark/overcast.

Grim means 'not so good,' I wasn't referring to dark/light balance. Your storytelling, drawing (esp smiles) and panel layouts are lacking. I'm being overly blunt with you because you were a c*nt to Neil, insulting his work because he gave you a critique you didn't like -- but a valid critique nonetheless. You came back with venom. That's grim as well. It bodes poorly for you.

kevinharte36
09-03-2017, 05:45 PM
https://preview.ibb.co/htooWv/8.png (https://ibb.co/cssFBv)

12013
09-03-2017, 06:02 PM
I just...I suspect that you think you are better than you actually are.

I would suggest objective assessment and a smidge of humbleness...

kevinharte36
09-03-2017, 06:11 PM
I just...I suspect that you think you are better than you actually are.

I would suggest objective assessment and a smidge of humbleness...

I'm setting my goals high doing this script. I plan on doing my best on about 100 pages, then pay for private tuition. I haven't sent these out to comic company's as I know I have alot to work on. I actually am not that confident in my abilities at present, but the past few months said that I should just go for it and have fun. Put in my 10,000 hours as they say.

MattTriano
09-03-2017, 08:15 PM
I'm setting my goals high doing this script. I plan on doing my best on about 100 pages, then pay for private tuition. I haven't sent these out to comic company's as I know I have alot to work on. I actually am not that confident in my abilities at present, but the past few months said that I should just go for it and have fun. Put in my 10,000 hours as they say.

Set your goals higher and do less pages; volume means nothing if the pages are just ok. Your pages are just ok. Framing, pacing, perspective and over-dependence on stiff photo ref make them not quite professional. You should just go for it and have fun but also understand that putting in your 10,000 hours -- or about 20 years -- isn't overly easy and rarely too fun. I don't know what private tuition means but if you're going to respond to critique in that setting the way you've done here? With contempt? Then fuck it, I suggest skipping that tutor/college program altogether and instead investing in a PS4. Far more fun. If you want to work? Comport yourself thus.

sevans
09-03-2017, 11:33 PM
PS4... what about an XBOX?

MattTriano
09-04-2017, 01:12 AM
PS4... what about an XBOX?

Clunky controller

DavidNH
09-04-2017, 03:46 PM
Let me breakdown your pages.

Page 1: The plane where the characters are standing is not clear. Its because you are not set the horizon line of the characters properly. Look at those feets. They are not interacting with the floor, each other is like standing on different floor. If the shadow is like that, The horizon line should be around their head. This page is already fail.

Page 2
Panel 1: The shoulder is weird. Again although the perspective of the building looks good, The character is not sync with the perspective of the horizon line.
Panel 2: Weird face, wrong hands, Good perspective. Somehow you managed to do perspective right here.
Panel 3: I wonder how you managed to draw those hands so right because on the previous panel you cant draw them properly. The hats are not sitting on their head properly. The faces are quite good. They are not out of proportion.

Page 3
Panel 1: The characters are quite good. But please sync the characters with your perspective.
Panel 2: Looks good. draw the plane where they stands and great hands on that performer.
Panel 3: Thats a good panel. Draw something at the background.
Panel 4: Im not sure about the hat, Overall nice shot.
Panel 5: Nice

Page 4
Panel 1: Thats quite good. Im not sure about the door tho. Is a door can be opened 180 degree?
Panel 2: All things here are not clear. Each characters stands on different plane and on different horizon line.
Panel 3:Why the head is like that? somehow the line is very different from the rest of the pages. Again the plane is not clear.
Panel 4: This is quite good although you need to rework them a bit.
Panel 5: Same crits as above

Page 5
Panel 1: I wonder how you can draw those drapery so good but you cant draw his pocket. Great angle
Panel 2: Nice shot.
Panel 3: Thats quite good.
Panel 4: Quite good too.
Panel 5: What is that curve line on his shoe? What is that suppose to be? Be clear with your environment
Panel 6: Hands?

Page 6
Panel 1: Great.
Panel 2: The plane where nightwing is standing and Nightwing himself didnt sync. Look at those feets and the floor line close to the door. It doesnt make sense.
Panel 3: quite good
Panel 4: Thats okay.

I suggest you learn more about the horizon line and how the characters sync with the plane they are interacting (standing, sitting, etc).

Draw good faces, your faces are dead.

Maybe I'm wrong but I think most of them looks traced from stills.

kevinharte36
09-04-2017, 04:25 PM
@DavidNH Thanks so much for the tips and being so thorough.Really appreciate it. I was having alot of difficulty with these pages and was constantly going back reworking them. Plus I'm still kind of getting used to Clip studio paint and the auto perspective.

With the faces I was using crazy talk 8 and trying to cartoonize the face. Think the problem was I was relying on it more than my own attempt at it. Finding facegen 3d is best, seems more realistic. For clothing reference I eventually found that just taking a photo of my arm,etc and using the wrinkles as ref made it alot easier and specific to what I needed.

jeffchris50
09-04-2017, 05:54 PM
@DavidNH Thanks so much for the tips and being so thorough.Really appreciate it. I was having alot of difficulty with these pages and was constantly going back reworking them. Plus I'm still kind of getting used to Clip studio paint and the auto perspective.

With the faces I was using crazy talk 8 and trying to cartoonize the face. Think the problem was I was relying on it more than my own attempt at it. Finding facegen 3d is best, seems more realistic. For clothing reference I eventually found that just taking a photo of my arm,etc and using the wrinkles as ref made it alot easier and specific to what I needed.

So---that's what wrong with this artwork!!! What you said summed it up in a nutshell.

This comment is not aimed at you, personally, kevin, nor YOUR specific artwork, but at most, if not all, of the artwork I see that's rendered digitally. It's lifeless and possesses no soul because a human hand has not imbued it with such.

It's kind of like the telepods in the Jeff Goldblum version of THE FLY; the telepods couldn't transport organic matter, be it baboon or T-bone steak, because it didn't understand it. Similar sensibility can be applied to rendering all art digitally.

If you're not an artist on paper or in some physical medium (which I don't know if you are or not) outside the digital realm, how can you expect to be an artist on the digital plane? Digital rendering, whether it be penciling, inking or coloring, can't make you a good artist, it can only make you a BETTER artist. You can't build a skyscraper on a foundation of marshmallows because it won't stand up, so if your physically rendered artwork is not really, really, REALLY good, then any digital artwork you do is going to, ultimately, fail.

There are plenty of artists both here, and on many of the other comics-art sites that I frequent, who make beautiful and awesome digital artwork, but you can bet your ass they've likely spent many, many, many hours with a pencil, pen, brush or marker in hand.

If you want to be a great digital artist, and, again, this applies to many folks, learn how to be a great ARTIST first, then you'll have a firm foundation on which to build.

Bishop
09-04-2017, 07:23 PM
Clunky controller

Heresy!

Bishop
09-04-2017, 07:35 PM
So---that's what wrong with this artwork!!! What you said summed it up in a nutshell.

This comment is not aimed at you, personally, kevin, nor YOUR specific artwork, but at most, if not all, of the artwork I see that's rendered digitally. It's lifeless, possesses no soul because a human hand has not imbued it with such.

It's kind of like the telepods in the Jeff Goldblum version of THE FLY; the telepods couldn't transport organic matter, be it baboon or T-bone steak because it didn't understand it. Similar sensibility can be applied to rendering all art digitally.

If you're not an artist on paper or in some physical medium (which I don't know if you are or not) outside the digital realm, how can you expect to be an artist on the digital plane? Digital rendering, whether it be penciling, inking or coloring, can't make you a good artist, it can only make you a BETTER artist. You can't build a skyscraper on a foundation of marshmallows because it won't stand up, so if your physically rendered artwork is not really, really, REALLY good, then any digital artwork you do is going to, ultimately, fail.

There are plenty of artists both here, and on many of the other comics-art sites that I frequent, who make beautiful and awesome digital artwork, but you can bet your ass they've likely spent many, many, many hours with a pencil, pen, brush or marker in hand.

If you want to be a great digital artist, and, again, this applies to many folks, learn how to be a great ARTIST first, then you'll have a firm foundation on which to build.

I think what you are trying to say is that digital should be used as a means to further your style, productivity, etc., and not as a crutch or a means to "cheat." Going full digital makes it very easy to straight up trace your "reference". These pages look like they are traces of 3d models, and that is what gives them their stiffness, strange poses/expressions, etc.

My advice to the artist would be to use the 3d assets as reference only, and use your eye to make them more believable in your drawings. You won't improve if you rely on tracing. Of course, I could be completely off base. That's just what it looks like to me.

Orlan29
09-04-2017, 08:43 PM
I like reading critiques and getting critiques as well sometimes its hard to accept the truth of needing more work but it should boost better for the artist to work harder. I like matttriano his work is incredible! if you see his site check it out I like to have a critique from him and very truthful about it. Just keep going, and put more pages one or two won"t do just do more like five or six or ten to show versatility.

All the best

Orlando Baez

jeffreygraphix
09-04-2017, 10:52 PM
Wow! Your line work is very crisp. Great job!

kevinharte36
09-05-2017, 08:02 AM
@ Bishop. I only used 3d for the faces and manequins in clip studio for perspective framing. Sure it would take too long to model all the characters in 3d, and then you'd still have to draw the wrinkles in the clothing anyway.

Bishop
09-05-2017, 09:11 AM
@ Bishop. I only used 3d for the faces and manequins in clip studio for perspective framing. Sure it would take too long to model all the characters in 3d, and then you'd still have to draw the wrinkles in the clothing anyway.

Fair enough. Then, I guess my advice stands that rather than strictly transferring exactly what you see on the model, use your instincts to modify what you see to be more true to life and not so stiff/lifeless. Perhaps, rather than using a 3D application for your facial references use actual photos? Google searches for images with the expressions you are looking for may be a much better resource for you.

DavidNH
09-05-2017, 11:59 AM
@DavidNH Thanks so much for the tips and being so thorough.Really appreciate it. I was having alot of difficulty with these pages and was constantly going back reworking them. Plus I'm still kind of getting used to Clip studio paint and the auto perspective.


Actually you dont need that auto perspective if you cant tell that page 1 is so wrong. You dont need to get used to CSP and that auto perspective. You need to understand that ALL the characters in page 1 is not standing on the same eye level. So that auto perspective is not really helping you get things right.


With the faces I was using crazy talk 8 and trying to cartoonize the face. Think the problem was I was relying on it more than my own attempt at it. Finding facegen 3d is best, seems more realistic. For clothing reference I eventually found that just taking a photo of my arm,etc and using the wrinkles as ref made it alot easier and specific to what I needed.

Again you dont need that crazytalk 8 program if even with that the faces are still far from good. Learn how to draw faces. Read Loomis books, practice them everyday. I dont believe if you really want to put 10.000 hours if even now you still choose shortcut to draw faces. And how can you draw all perfect hands if the hands on panel 2 page 2 so wrong.

@ Bishop. I only used 3d for the faces and manequins in clip studio for perspective framing. Sure it would take too long to model all the characters in 3d, and then you'd still have to draw the wrinkles in the clothing anyway.

Perspective framing? So why nightwing on page 6 panel 2 looks like floating instead of standing?

Almost all of your claim isnt seen on your works here. You said you use perspective on csp but the characters on page 1 are wrong, even the shadows are wrong. You said you wanna put 10.000 hours but how some of the faces are out of proportion and some dont? Do you really understand the proportion of faces?

Its not that it is wrong to use them. But dont rely on them. Learn the fundamentals first, Learn how to draw faces, learn perspective, And put your 10.000 hours practicing

Get Loomis books, Hogarth books, Bridgman books. Learn from them.

Programs wont make you a great artist. Only you can make yourself great.

kevinharte36
09-05-2017, 05:16 PM
@DavidNH page 6 panel 2 was set up with a 3d mannequin posed out then drawn on top. It's a close up, I don't understand how you think it's floating.

Maybe if you want to draw on top and show the correction? Clip studio must be inaccurate. I think it's a great program, because you can use all sorts of angles.

MattTriano
09-05-2017, 07:31 PM
@DavidNH page 6 panel 2 was set up with a 3d mannequin posed out then drawn on top. It's a close up, I don't understand how you think it's floating.

Maybe if you want to draw on top and show the correction? Clip studio must be inaccurate. I think it's a great program, because you can use all sorts of angles.

You tilted the panel information, called 'dutching' in film.

People seated at a table is something we all know happens on a level floor. So. Why'd you tilt the panel info?

The only reason you dutched the info in 6.2 (if it's the page I think we're talking about the newest one) is to fit all the information you wanted in the panel without having to re-work your layout to comfortably and properly do so. Well that's an issue because now your boardroom table and guys in normal desk chairs are tilted in a thin horizontal panel that's squashing the composition AND your panel borders serve to remind the reader what horizontal and vertical look like. Therefore it appears as though these guys are having the meeting in fucking space! Floating in other words. Disrupting eyeflow, causing the reader to doubt what's going on even a little bit and perhaps taking them out of the story. Your job: keep them IN the story.

I'm currently drawing pages using clip studio and while I've found the perspective tool to be a little frustrating, that's my fault for not understanding the program as well as I should. But if you can't do it using pencil on paper, I'm afraid you'll always blame your digital tools instead of yourself. Clip is a tool. Learn perspective and Clip more thoroughly, it'll suck but worth it.

Re: 1.1 -- it looks goofy because (again) you dutched the fucking angle. Why does it look weird? Because the ground is often -- but not always -- flat. Yet your figures are tilted like they're walking downhill, except no one can walk downhill like that and boom you've created a disconnect with the reader. On page 1 panel 1. Uh oh.

Am I explaining this clearly? Tell me.

Orlan29
09-05-2017, 08:05 PM
I like the idea of using software programs like auto cad and etc for enchancing comicbook perspective in pages but I really don't trust it kind makes the work look too good I rather traditionally just pencil sequentials on paper and rather draw people from pictures rather using 3d models they don't look natural they are stiff

Scary thing is what if your computer crashes and you need the pages delivered on time and no physical art for copies what then?

Orlando

MattTriano
09-05-2017, 09:42 PM
I like the idea of using software programs like auto cad and etc for enchancing comicbook perspective in pages but I really don't trust it kind makes the work look too good I rather traditionally just pencil sequentials on paper and rather draw people from pictures rather using 3d models they don't look natural they are stiff

Scary thing is what if your computer crashes and you need the pages delivered on time and no physical art for copies what then?

Orlando

You're late. It's happened to me in a minor way, a page or part of one; I've thankfully never lost an issue but it's happened. Freddie Williams (who has been working digital for over a decade) now triple-saves his pages on internal and external drives after losing a bunch of work. Good habit in general, if you can.

jeffchris50
09-06-2017, 12:04 AM
I like the idea of using software programs like auto cad and etc for enchancing comicbook perspective in pages but I really don't trust it kind makes the work look too good I rather traditionally just pencil sequentials on paper and rather draw people from pictures rather using 3d models they don't look natural they are stiff

Scary thing is what if your computer crashes and you need the pages delivered on time and no physical art for copies what then?

Orlando

Oh yes, if you're going to work digitally, you'd better have lots of automatic, redundant back-up as well as a pretty robust battery backup for the computer in order to save stuff to said redundant drives in the event of a blackout. I learned that the hard way when I was scripting DEADWALKERS a long time ago and I lost the script to the entire third and fourth issues. Man, was that a moral breaker! UGH! Never, ever, ever again!!!!

kevinharte36
09-06-2017, 08:15 AM
You tilted the panel information, called 'dutching' in film.

People seated at a table is something we all know happens on a level floor. So. Why'd you tilt the panel info?

The only reason you dutched the info in 6.2 (if it's the page I think we're talking about the newest one) is to fit all the information you wanted in the panel without having to re-work your layout to comfortably and properly do so. Well that's an issue because now your boardroom table and guys in normal desk chairs are tilted in a thin horizontal panel that's squashing the composition AND your panel borders serve to remind the reader what horizontal and vertical look like. Therefore it appears as though these guys are having the meeting in fucking space! Floating in other words. Disrupting eyeflow, causing the reader to doubt what's going on even a little bit and perhaps taking them out of the story. Your job: keep them IN the story.

I'm currently drawing pages using clip studio and while I've found the perspective tool to be a little frustrating, that's my fault for not understanding the program as well as I should. But if you can't do it using pencil on paper, I'm afraid you'll always blame your digital tools instead of yourself. Clip is a tool. Learn perspective and Clip more thoroughly, it'll suck but worth it.

Re: 1.1 -- it looks goofy because (again) you dutched the fucking angle. Why does it look weird? Because the ground is often -- but not always -- flat. Yet your figures are tilted like they're walking downhill, except no one can walk downhill like that and boom you've created a disconnect with the reader. On page 1 panel 1. Uh oh.

Am I explaining this clearly? Tell me.

Thanks, yep.

Pg.6 panel 2 was what I was talking about.
https://image.ibb.co/fh60gv/pg_6_panel_2.png (https://imgbb.com/)

Dutching example pg 8 panel 2. The page after someone gets beheaded, so dutching was creating sea sickness?

https://preview.ibb.co/iENZ8a/dutching.png (https://ibb.co/hhn1oa)


Bought these posable figures,seem pretty neat:)
No PS4 :(

https://preview.ibb.co/kQGY1v/1.jpg (https://ibb.co/dq2j8a)
https://preview.ibb.co/i0Droa/3.jpg (https://ibb.co/hNd2uF)
https://preview.ibb.co/heGNuF/HTB1_P_c1_NXXXXXcz_Xp_XXq6x_XFXXXD.jpg (https://ibb.co/cXMY1v)

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/PL2016-M34-1-6-Scale-Super-Flexible-Male-Muscular-Seamless-Body-Suntan-TB-League-Phicen/32817917786.html
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Phicen-PL2016-M32-1-6-Super-flexible-Asia-Male-Seamless-Body-no-head-sculpt/32733053131.html
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Phicen-PLMB2016-S16A-PLMB2016-S17B-female-super-flexible-seamless-body-pale-suntan-medium-breast/32733990120.html

and study Mattesi books.

MattTriano
09-06-2017, 05:37 PM
Thanks, yep.

Pg.6 panel 2 was what I was talking about.
https://image.ibb.co/fh60gv/pg_6_panel_2.png (https://imgbb.com/)

Dutching example pg 8 panel 2. The page after someone gets beheaded, so dutching was creating sea sickness?

https://preview.ibb.co/iENZ8a/dutching.png (https://ibb.co/hhn1oa)


Bought these,seem pretty neat:)
No PS4 :(

https://preview.ibb.co/kQGY1v/1.jpg (https://ibb.co/dq2j8a)
https://preview.ibb.co/i0Droa/3.jpg (https://ibb.co/hNd2uF)
https://preview.ibb.co/heGNuF/HTB1_P_c1_NXXXXXcz_Xp_XXq6x_XFXXXD.jpg (https://ibb.co/cXMY1v)

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/PL2016-M34-1-6-Scale-Super-Flexible-Male-Muscular-Seamless-Body-Suntan-TB-League-Phicen/32817917786.html
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Phicen-PL2016-M32-1-6-Super-flexible-Asia-Male-Seamless-Body-no-head-sculpt/32733053131.html
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Phicen-PLMB2016-S16A-PLMB2016-S17B-female-super-flexible-seamless-body-pale-suntan-medium-breast/32733990120.html

and study Mattesi books.

RE: PANEL CONFUSION + SEASICKNESS: I don't see what's floating in the Nightwing panel but YES the guys sitting around the table - both in yours and in the printed page as well -- are creating an uneasy and unnecessary relationship btwn page form and content, they look like they're in a fucking yacht on choppy seas! Is that Ivan Reis or Eddy Barrows pencils?

RE: 3D FIGS: They're cool but don't use them as gospel. Even in that first pose -- which is good -- the guy's bicep is smushed into his chest like it hasn't breadth and width, structure where it needs. If you decided to be lazy and use that very well rendered and generally cool 3d model image as direct ref without any other ref images (to supplement your visual library and give the thing volume in your mind's eye) your drawing would be wack and everyone would be telling you so. And you might think (or even say) 'but I used reference.' And you did, just not enough. Not enough for YOU to understand what you're drawing enough for the READER to buy it.

PS4 graphics are incredible and the games seem very fun but don't actually buy a video game system if you want to draw comics. Sorta kidding, sorta not. They just take too much time. Both things. To do simultaneously and also have a life outside those two. FYI for all.

Orlan29
09-06-2017, 08:28 PM
Of course I actually like for the help in figure drawing anatomy in comics

https://bodykun.com/products/body-kun-models-for-artists

Not too expensive if find the right store

I purchased these and it helped me using them in the Avenger Marvel sample

pages.

Orlando Baez

jeffchris50
09-06-2017, 11:03 PM
Of course I actually like for the help in figure drawing anatomy in comics

https://bodykun.com/products/body-kun-models-for-artists

Not too expensive if find the right store

I purchased these and it helped me using them in the Avenger Marvel sample

pages.

Orlando Baez

Those are some pretty cool mannequins, Orlando. Looks like they have a lot more flexibility than the wooden ones you can find and most art supply shops. Might have to pick up a couple of those myself. Thanks for the link!

Neil Allen
09-07-2017, 06:57 PM
Neil, I find your criticisms very odd. You generally seem very strict on what needs fixing then at the end of it your post links to your work and it's mainly done with crayons and has alot of room for improvement.

That being said thanks, I'll work on my head constructions.

Probably the most ignorant post I've ever seen here ever. If you want to criticize my art, go ahead, although, the whole "You used a crayon" thing is kinda' dumb, at least in my opinion, since that's not really indicative of anyone's skill, and amazing work has been done with crayons. However, there are appropriate places to criticize my art. This isn't one of them, by the way.

My criticisms were not odd at all, and I was not even strict. If your faces are as exaggerated as yours are in the samples you posted, they're really going to stand out to people reading your comic. Pointing that out is not being nitpicky. If you're copying and pasting the same image over and over again (at least in the way that you did) it's really going to stand out in a negative way. This isn't like 'the hand is a little too large, the whole picture is ruined,' or 'that eye is a little too far to the left, I hate the whole thing.' Another thing, too, is that the face issue keeps repeating (those girls were just the biggest offenders), so, to my eye, at least, it's a pretty major issue in the work that will have an affect on most readers.

sevans
09-07-2017, 08:27 PM
I think this thread should die. Personal Opinion.
Everyone has had their say, positive and negative.

MattTriano
09-07-2017, 11:44 PM
I think this thread should die. Personal Opinion.
Everyone has had their say, positive and negative.

That's nice. Not up to you of course, I'd reckon that would be kevinharte36. If he has more art to post, more comments to add, you don't get to say he doesn't.

sevans
09-08-2017, 05:17 AM
I know that.
Just feels like some bickering is going to start again.

Leave the egos at the door when posting art for crits.

Neil Allen
09-08-2017, 08:05 AM
Now, this is just my opinion, and others may disagree, but at the state your art is at now, OP, I would focus less on making comics, and more on doing drawing exercises. Things like drawing certain body parts over and over again, and figures at different angles, faces and smiles, and things like that. I think exercises like that will help A LOT, and make the process of making comics a lot easier. And I'm not saying you should do those exclusively for, like, a year, just practice hands and faces for two weeks straight and see how much it will help if you work on it everyday. If you don't fix those fundamental things, you can keep making comics and making the same mistakes, and continuing to struggle with trying to correctly convey your ideas. While doing sequential art certainly isn't bad, and a learning experience in itself, I believe it would be a good idea to focus more on certain art principles and just the figure, face, and hands in general.

As a disclaimer, you may not like my art, you may not like how I colored something, or a medium I used, or you may not like me, period, and all that is okay, but I'm not making REALLY freaked out looking faces on a regular basis, or fingers that look like hot dogs (see page 2, panel 2). So I think I may have something worthwhile to say, hence why I've commented. And even if I didn't attempt art at all, I think some of the things I said may be at least worth considering.

12013
09-08-2017, 09:43 PM
I know that.
Just feels like some bickering is going to start again.

Leave the egos at the door when posting art for crits.

yeah sure.

but NOTHING is going on around these forums. theres NO discussions all all. about anything. (speaking broadly here). but theres something going on right here. it hasn't devolved into a shit show even remotely yet. so..just let it be. cause nothing else is happening. theres at least a SPARK of life here.
its the ONE thread I keep checking every time I come back.

maybe we need some bickering at some level. cause dead forums are boring AF

sevans
09-09-2017, 03:11 AM
dead forums are boring AF

hahaha, very true.

kevinharte36
09-09-2017, 07:25 AM
RE: PANEL CONFUSION + SEASICKNESS: I don't see what's floating in the Nightwing panel but YES the guys sitting around the table - both in yours and in the printed page as well -- are creating an uneasy and unnecessary relationship btwn page form and content, they look like they're in a fucking yacht on choppy seas! Is that Ivan Reis or Eddy Barrows pencils?

RE: 3D FIGS: They're cool but don't use them as gospel. Even in that first pose -- which is good -- the guy's bicep is smushed into his chest like it hasn't breadth and width, structure where it needs. If you decided to be lazy and use that very well rendered and generally cool 3d model image as direct ref without any other ref images (to supplement your visual library and give the thing volume in your mind's eye) your drawing would be wack and everyone would be telling you so. And you might think (or even say) 'but I used reference.' And you did, just not enough. Not enough for YOU to understand what you're drawing enough for the READER to buy it.

PS4 graphics are incredible and the games seem very fun but don't actually buy a video game system if you want to draw comics. Sorta kidding, sorta not. They just take too much time. Both things. To do simultaneously and also have a life outside those two. FYI for all.

Yes it's Eddy Barrows. Personally I like the old school panel layouts like Steve Dillon, Kirby,etc.

Going to study these more, already can see mistakes pop out more after watching some of these tutorials.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07fusT-dwVE&t=5s&index=1&list=PLy0nywfKRdOUrfjfmMCrVCz0KyTjRDC6f

https://preview.ibb.co/gVeSGv/He_She_Male_Female_6.jpg (https://ibb.co/iuX3pF)
share photo free (https://imgbb.com/)

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/He-She-Male-Female-PVC-Action-Figure-Model-Body-Toy-For-Cartoon-Drawing-use-the-ability/32821658038.html?spm=a2g0s.8937460.0.0.nUPpIT
Pretty cheap, $8.66