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View Full Version : Batman killed by his own dad?


VeaVictus
11-28-2008, 07:31 PM
I didn't know where this belongs so I am putting it here.
Batman is dead (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/showbiz/film/article1982939.ece)

So who do you think will take over the cape?

pi0trov
11-28-2008, 07:46 PM
I didn't know where this belongs so I am putting it here.

Maybe here: http://www.digitalwebbing.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=85

Biofungus
11-28-2008, 07:50 PM
Batman's not dead. :)

The very last page or two of the issue pretty much confirms it.

Paul Sanderson
11-28-2008, 09:44 PM
Yeah, this is a temporary measure to boost sales, nothing more. With WB now having the 2nd highest grossing film of all time, a film starring the Bruce Wayne Batman, we all know that Bruce will be back in the cowl before too long.

ArtisticBlasts
11-28-2008, 10:33 PM
Agree .... he's became an icon already. Unlike Dan Garrett and Ted Kord on Blue Beetle mantle. DC won't get him behind far too long, he's going to be back.

Paul Sanderson
11-29-2008, 12:19 AM
Which begs the question (of DC)...why bother?

Moonrider
11-29-2008, 12:29 AM
Why so serious?

ArtisticBlasts
11-29-2008, 01:19 AM
Because it affects my reading and money spending moods .... :(

hellblazer72
11-29-2008, 01:21 AM
Which begs the question (of DC)...why bother?

for the same reason they replaced him with azrael back in the 90's..so people don't forget that bruce wayne is the only one that can handle being batman without going psycho..

ArtisticBlasts
11-29-2008, 02:00 AM
for the same reason they replaced him with azrael back in the 90's..so people don't forget that bruce wayne is the only one that can handle being batman without going psycho..
Yup. That's because Bruce Wayne's psychotic psychology (in certain ways!) is the only one that fits the Batman mantle as well :)

Paul Sanderson
11-29-2008, 05:41 PM
for the same reason they replaced him with azrael back in the 90's..so people don't forget that bruce wayne is the only one that can handle being batman without going psycho..

I don't think there's an inherent need for the audience to re-visit that re-hashed plot again. That's pretty tiresome. In reality, DC (or WB) wanted a short term sales buzz that this kind of gimmick usually engenders. I mean look, this is being reported in the newspapers, so it's working to an extent. Unfortunately, this kind of lame-brained exercise only works short term, and does nothing to increase sales in the long term, which is what DC should be looking at.

Moonrider
12-01-2008, 06:20 AM
How about a dick punch, you fucking spammer?

HaphazardJoy
12-01-2008, 08:13 AM
How about a dick punch, you fucking spammer?

Morning Made.

Aidy
12-02-2008, 06:39 AM
Agree .... he's became an icon already. Unlike Dan Garrett and Ted Kord on Blue Beetle mantle. DC won't get him behind far too long, he's going to be back.

You suggesting that Ted Kord isnt an icon? He is in my house!

ArtisticBlasts
12-02-2008, 08:19 PM
You suggesting that Ted Kord isnt an icon? He is in my house!
But in the end he's expendable, to Dan DiDio's DC. And someone else filling in his shoes :(

Aidy
12-03-2008, 08:01 AM
But in the end he's expendable, to Dan DiDio's DC. And someone else filling in his shoes :(

indeed. but its only a matter of time. Connor Kents on his way back...so I owuldnt be surprised if Ted does eventually make his way back to the land of the living.

Ted had to die, and he died brilliantly but that doesnt mean I happy with it,.

Moonrider
12-03-2008, 08:46 AM
But in the end he's expendable, to Dan DiDio's DC. And someone else filling in his shoes :(

It's comic books, every character is expendable either by death or cancellation.

Aidy
12-03-2008, 09:09 AM
It's comic books, every character is expendable either by death or cancellation.

except for Scott Summers.

Moonrider
12-03-2008, 12:37 PM
Cyclops 'died' once. No wait, twice if you count the movie.

Paul Sanderson
12-03-2008, 05:48 PM
Ted Kord will be back too, there's no long term future in this new Blue Beetle, despite what some here may say.

HaphazardJoy
12-03-2008, 07:26 PM
Cyclops' death did play out much more like a planned shortterm event at least. He was joined with Apocalypse and then destroyed. Then found amnesiac shortly thereafter as himself without powers and Pocky stuck inside his psyche.

Aidy
12-04-2008, 06:25 AM
Cyclops 'died' once. No wait, twice if you count the movie.

I dont count the movie and his "death" was more of a possession. He will never die...

SillySully7
12-04-2008, 02:54 PM
Batman BRB

Eugene Selassie
12-07-2008, 11:20 AM
I don't see what the beef is with Jaime Reyes as Blue Beetle.

I like Ted Kord as much as the next person, but to be honest, he is nothing but another tech savvy masked mystery man...and at DC, those characters are a dime a dozen.

Jaime is a WELL WRITTEN teen character (probably the only well written teen at that company these days) and he's got a cool GUYVER set up with many nods to past continuity.

AND Jaime's book stayed afloat longer than ANY Ted Kord series.

Sorry if some of you like to keep your heads up your silver and bronze age asses. :slap:

ArtisticBlasts
12-07-2008, 08:47 PM
I don't see what the beef is with Jaime Reyes as Blue Beetle.

I like Ted Kord as much as the next person, but to be honest, he is nothing but another tech savvy masked mystery man...and at DC, those characters are a dime a dozen.

Jaime is a WELL WRITTEN teen character (probably the only well written teen at that company these days) and he's got a cool GUYVER set up with many nods to past continuity.

AND Jaime's book stayed afloat longer than ANY Ted Kord series.

Sorry if some of you like to keep your heads up your silver and bronze age asses. :slap:
I'd rather read any books that has some connections with the golden age era mystery men nowadays ...

Paul Sanderson
12-08-2008, 03:53 AM
The Ted Kord series written by Len Wein and illustrated by Paris Cullins ran quite long, too. Kord will be back in the BB suit at some point. It's inevitable in comics.

Moonrider
12-08-2008, 09:51 AM
The Ted Kord series written by Len Wein and illustrated by Paris Cullins ran quite long, too. Kord will be back in the BB suit at some point. It's inevitable in comics.

Ted Kord was already back and gone again. But I think Jaime Reyes' character will stick around for a long time, with or without his own series.

maverick
12-08-2008, 10:20 AM
batman wtf

Moonrider
12-08-2008, 10:42 AM
Batman STFU

Batman LOL

Batman asl pls

raya
12-08-2008, 11:15 AM
I'm not even sure why this would be a great plot to boost sales. As soon as I saw the title I thought of "Star Wars", where Darth Vader turns out to be Luke's Dad. :huh:

Moonrider
12-08-2008, 11:20 AM
It's not like that at all, actually. The villain was never revealed to be Bruce's dad.

jmassie
12-08-2008, 08:20 PM
I expected more from Morrison. I didn't think this was actually going to be a literal death at the end. I really like his writing for the most part, but this was just too much of a bitch out. I expected my mind to be blown.

William Blankenship
12-08-2008, 08:42 PM
Which begs the question (of DC)...why bother?


Begs the question is more like a circular argument.

I haven't read any of this, but I'd say maybe the fans know that he will be back eventually, and have comfort in that, and in that comfort they may accept something different being done with the bat titles for a while, which may provide some interesting stories. Hell, I'm interested in picking up the trade from what I've heard, and if it's cool I may follow it. I already know what happens because of this spoiler facking thread title, but I still may read.

Joking about the thread title, I knew wayyyyy beofre that because of my podcast addiction.

3!LL

Paul Sanderson
12-08-2008, 11:38 PM
Ted Kord was already back and gone again. But I think Jaime Reyes' character will stick around for a long time, with or without his own series.

No, I don't think he'll be a long term character. A few years, sure, but not long term, I really don't think so.

Paul Sanderson
12-08-2008, 11:39 PM
Begs the question is more like a circular argument.

I haven't read any of this, but I'd say maybe the fans know that he will be back eventually, and have comfort in that, and in that comfort they may accept something different being done with the bat titles for a while, which may provide some interesting stories. Hell, I'm interested in picking up the trade from what I've heard, and if it's cool I may follow it. I already know what happens because of this spoiler facking thread title, but I still may read.

Joking about the thread title, I knew wayyyyy beofre that because of my podcast addiction.

3!LL

Yes, but the bare bones of this whole entire plot/storyline has been done before. The whole thing is pointless and a waste of time.

Moonrider
12-09-2008, 07:40 AM
No, I don't think he'll be a long term character. A few years, sure, but not long term, I really don't think so.

Well, you have your religion and I have mine. :laugh:

ArtisticBlasts
12-09-2008, 11:12 AM
I think this is all DC's management doings so that they can get off from paying royalties to Bob Kane's decendants or so from using Bruce Wayne, and making a new Batman legacy out of Bruce Wayne. Sheeeeeeesh ....

Paul Sanderson
12-10-2008, 05:33 PM
No, no, it's just their way of creating a short term shock value gimmick, which gets the storyline into the newspapers, gets a few extra sales, then the thing dies away and Bruce Wayne will be back. We've seen it all before.

Aidy
12-16-2008, 11:23 AM
I don't see what the beef is with Jaime Reyes as Blue Beetle.

I like Ted Kord as much as the next person, but to be honest, he is nothing but another tech savvy masked mystery man...and at DC, those characters are a dime a dozen.

Jaime is a WELL WRITTEN teen character (probably the only well written teen at that company these days) and he's got a cool GUYVER set up with many nods to past continuity.

AND Jaime's book stayed afloat longer than ANY Ted Kord series.

Sorry if some of you like to keep your heads up your silver and bronze age asses. :slap:

Has nothing to do with my head and/or my ass....he's my main man and my favorite DC character. His death -at the hands of his old employer/team leader was a kick in the stones (an enjoyable one) to all old JKI readers who had grown up with the Blue and the Gold kicking ass and making jokes.

I like Jamie, but he aint Ted...and I dont think He'll be Blue Beetle as long as Ted was . Cos Ted was and is the Man.

WSSmith
12-16-2008, 03:50 PM
I may read to much BATMAN, but it was time someone did this story! There is so much cool stuff about the Wayne's and past continuity this series used well. I enjoyed this story a ton every issue, but the Robin and Nightwing tie-ins were a tad boring.

Moonrider
12-16-2008, 09:56 PM
Has nothing to do with my head and/or my ass....he's my main man and my favorite DC character. His death -at the hands of his old employer/team leader was a kick in the stones (an enjoyable one) to all old JKI readers who had grown up with the Blue and the Gold kicking ass and making jokes.

I like Jamie, but he aint Ted...and I dont think He'll be Blue Beetle as long as Ted was . Cos Ted was and is the Man.

Well, there's the character and the title of Blue Beetle. I have no doubt that Ted Kord will be back sooner or later, in fact he already did for a few issues or so in Booster Gold. But the current Blue Beetle has more roots to the original golden age character, actually have super powers and a really cool concept I might add, interesting supporting characters, accessible to newer readers, and have so much untapped potential for future stories. Let's say they kill him off, what then? Bring back the scarab to Ted so he can wear the armor just for the sake of the older fans? Alienate the kids who follow and relate to Jaime Reyes' stories for some older dude they know nothing about? Or simply wipe out all continuity after Infiite Crisis and just bring back the Ted Kord version, return to the status quo and leave those who bought all those issues of Blue Beetle and Teen Titans feel cheated?

If older fans like Frank think that comics shouldn't do drastic changes in the characters at all if things will just return like the way it was because it smelled too gimmicky, I'd say if they do decide to make drastic changes then they should stick with it.

Paul Sanderson
12-16-2008, 10:00 PM
I never said they should or shouldn't change things. It's the way those changes are achieved and various other factors that sometimes irk me.

In regards to Blue Beetle...I knew from the start this new BB wasn't going to last long term, and I stand by that statement. He just doesn't have the legs, so to speak. And I think I'll be proven right on that score over time.

kdmelrose
12-16-2008, 10:15 PM
The Jaime Reyes title outlasted the 1980s Ted Kord series, and Jaime has a prominent, recurring role in Batman: The Brave and the Bold animated series, and in the Teen Titans comic series.

So, while the comic was canceled, it looks like the character will be sticking around for a while.

Aidy
12-17-2008, 08:11 AM
Well, there's the character and the title of Blue Beetle. I have no doubt that Ted Kord will be back sooner or later, in fact he already did for a few issues or so in Booster Gold. But the current Blue Beetle has more roots to the original golden age character, actually have super powers and a really cool concept I might add, interesting supporting characters, accessible to newer readers, and have so much untapped potential for future stories. Let's say they kill him off, what then? Bring back the scarab to Ted so he can wear the armor just for the sake of the older fans? Alienate the kids who follow and relate to Jaime Reyes' stories for some older dude they know nothing about? Or simply wipe out all continuity after Infiite Crisis and just bring back the Ted Kord version, return to the status quo and leave those who bought all those issues of Blue Beetle and Teen Titans feel cheated?

If older fans like Frank think that comics shouldn't do drastic changes in the characters at all if things will just return like the way it was because it smelled too gimmicky, I'd say if they do decide to make drastic changes then they should stick with it.

indeed. If Ted came back and got the scarab and the Armour I'd feel cheated, he lasted for 20 years in the DCU without powers and special abilities, using only his wits, humor, BB gun and the bug to fight crime and kick ass. I enjoyed Keith's run on the Jamie BB, especially his writing regarding the now alien origins for the Scarab. And I think Jamie works well in the Teen Titans now he and Red Devil have a little schtick going on between them.
As for the Ted Kord story in the current run of Boooster Gold, another excellent story that showed why comic book readers of my age think Ted Kord rules, he had another chance at life but knew that time would be broke if he continued to live...
The answer I think is to have Jamie as the powered BB in the Titans and if and when Ted does come back have him in the JLS as their Blue Beetle working with Dr Midnight and Mike Holt. Or even better as a ruling member of Checkmate.

Moonrider
12-17-2008, 09:02 AM
I never said they should or shouldn't change things. It's the way those changes are achieved and various other factors that sometimes irk me.

Uh..that is basically what I said. Because "it's too gimmicky".

Ted Kord as a Checkmate operative sounds interesting. It's a good way to get back on the guy who murdered him.

Paul Sanderson
12-17-2008, 05:47 PM
It does sound interesting. A good stepping stone to getting back in the blue suit, too, which will undoubtedly happen in time.

WOLVIE
12-17-2008, 06:06 PM
How original :yawn: . No wonder people don't read comics anymore.

Moonrider
12-26-2008, 09:47 AM
Okay...so Batman didn't die at all when the helicopter crashed. He went home as fit as a fiddle and then the JLA called about the bullet that killed Orion, and so Final Crisis began. Batman RIP...huh, talk about a misleading title.

HaphazardJoy
12-26-2008, 10:46 AM
Okay...so Batman didn't die at all when the helicopter crashed. He went home as fit as a fiddle and then the JLA called about the bullet that killed Orion, and so Final Crisis began. Batman RIP...huh, talk about a misleading title.

Uh, what?
It's an unfortunate sequence of events. Batman RIP doesn't fit into Final Crisis exactly, nor does it address the aftermath. Still, the general idea is that RIP happens after Final Crisis. The past week's Batman issue which features scenes from Final Crisis doesn't necessarily happen in issue order, it was yet another reason to go back and look at Batman in terms of what was and what could have been.

Deadfish07
12-26-2008, 11:21 AM
DC continuity is such a mess, who can really tell anymore? I guess it doesn't help that Final Crisis' publication moves so slow. I guess it makes sense that the past two issues of Batman were meant to be published before RIP.

Paul Sanderson
12-26-2008, 07:50 PM
None of this mess makes much sense.

Moonrider
12-26-2008, 11:39 PM
Uh, what?
It's an unfortunate sequence of events. Batman RIP doesn't fit into Final Crisis exactly, nor does it address the aftermath. Still, the general idea is that RIP happens after Final Crisis. The past week's Batman issue which features scenes from Final Crisis doesn't necessarily happen in issue order, it was yet another reason to go back and look at Batman in terms of what was and what could have been.

Nope. Batman RIP happened just before Final Crisis. The Last Rites thing is basically a recap of everything that happened in Bruce's life, then it touched a bit about if he never become Batman. It does address the aftermath of Batman RIP, as told by the real Alfred at the end of Batman #683.

Paul Sanderson
12-27-2008, 12:22 AM
Nope. Batman RIP happened just before Final Crisis. The Last Rites thing is basically a recap of everything that happened in Bruce's life, then it touched a bit about if he never become Batman. It does address the aftermath of Batman RIP, as told by the real Alfred at the end of Batman #683.

So WTF happened to Batman to make him give up being Batman? Or what forced him to? :blink:

Mwynn
12-27-2008, 12:36 AM
So WTF happened to Batman to make him give up being Batman? Or what forced him to? :blink:
Final Crisis 6 and 7.

Paul Sanderson
12-27-2008, 07:56 AM
And the events of that were?

HaphazardJoy
12-27-2008, 08:15 AM
Nothing made him give up being Batman, it's all part of a dream/virtual reality brainwashing that's part of the events of Final Crisis, the reason it's relevant to Last Rites and not RIP is that although it takes place before RIP, it goes along with the rest of Last Rites to display what made Batman Batman.

Moonrider
12-27-2008, 08:37 AM
Nothing made him give up being Batman, it's all part of a dream/virtual reality brainwashing that's part of the events of Final Crisis, the reason it's relevant to Last Rites and not RIP is that although it takes place before RIP, it goes along with the rest of Last Rites to display what made Batman Batman.

Have you read Batman #683?
They weren't trying to brainwash him, they were trying to copy his memories to apokoliptian clones (yes, clones if you can believe it!) that supposedly will become an unstoppable army for Darkseid. The dreamlike sequences are real memories that they are trying to gather for the clones, the only vision that is not real is the false memory about him never become Batman which was stated as something to keep Batman's mind occupied until they find the real hidden memory parts that they want to know about. Last Rites happened during Final Crisis, and Final Crisis happened right after Batman RIP. It's explained right there.

HaphazardJoy
12-27-2008, 11:12 AM
Sure Kid.
Yes, they were trying to copy him, but it didn't take place after RIP. They were trying to copy Batman's mind before that, and he resisted it and overcame the brainwashing.

Mwynn
12-27-2008, 11:23 AM
And the events of that were?
They have not come out yet.

Mwynn
12-27-2008, 11:26 AM
Sure Kid.
Yes, they were trying to copy him, but it didn't take place after RIP. They were trying to copy Batman's mind before that, and he resisted it and overcame the brainwashing.
He is right. RIP happened, which then leads to Final Crisis. Bruce even gets the call about Orion. Now he has a hold of Darkseids bullet. Now what would make Bruce not want to be Batman anymore. How about killing Turpin to stop Darkseid.

Moonrider
12-27-2008, 12:53 PM
Sure Kid.
Yes, they were trying to copy him, but it didn't take place after RIP. They were trying to copy Batman's mind before that, and he resisted it and overcame the brainwashing.

Don't call me Kid. I'm not that intense.

NickGuy
12-27-2008, 02:30 PM
Simon claims he is really Dr Thomas Wayne, saying he faked his own passing when Bruce was a child.


http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/574/92807-107223-batman-year-one_large.jpg


.........right

NickGuy
12-27-2008, 02:31 PM
DC continuity is such a mess, who can really tell anymore?

QFT, at least ASBAR has its continuity all in a row AND comes out on time! :)

Mwynn
12-27-2008, 02:38 PM
DC Continuity is fine. It has always be said that the results of Final Crisis will show in the regular books in March.

Paul Sanderson
12-27-2008, 07:03 PM
DC continuity is a mess and has been ever since they started screwing around with it again in the 90s. It's just gotten worse and worse since then.

Mwynn
12-27-2008, 07:13 PM
DC continuity is a mess and has been ever since they started screwing around with it again in the 90s. It's just gotten worse and worse since then.
Easy to follow if you actually read the books.

HaphazardJoy
12-27-2008, 09:51 PM
After looking at that Battle for the Cowl picture, it's clear Bruce Wayne isn't going into hiding, at least not totally (though he might wanna if everyone knew he was Batman). As to why he would give up being Batman in upcoming events, I'd just guess that he would question his own competency after the events that produced RIP. Possibly the events of Final Crisis, but then he IS still Batman in RIP. After flipping his lid and reverting to an alternate personality and being so readily manipulated by Hurt, I don't think he'd be willing to go on again until he can be sure he's stable.

Then again, after your Hush comment in the other thread, maybe you're absolutely right.

Paul Sanderson
12-28-2008, 06:41 PM
Easy to follow if you actually read the books.

Pretty confusing overall. It's a mess, pure and simple.

HaphazardJoy
12-28-2008, 10:48 PM
I find, with DC, it really IS easy to follow if you just read the books and take them at face value. It only becomes really confusing when you try to make it into a wikipedia entry. If you take the continuity and look at it in terms of plot, and set the frame of reference in terms of, say, the past 5 years of books, there's nothing confusing about it really. Outside of that, major plot events still apply, but otherwise theme's more important over the long term.
Sure today's books don't connect as well with continuity from the 80's, or those with that of the 60's.

I think that's just comics in general, but especially DC with their world reboots that really don't change a whole lot except to make things a mess for a few months. Even there, it's only confusing if you think about it too much. The books chug on like usual, and the status quo doesn't change all that much.

Mwynn
12-28-2008, 11:29 PM
I find, with DC, it really IS easy to follow if you just read the books and take them at face value. It only becomes really confusing when you try to make it into a wikipedia entry. If you take the continuity and look at it in terms of plot, and set the frame of reference in terms of, say, the past 5 years of books, there's nothing confusing about it really. Outside of that, major plot events still apply, but otherwise theme's more important over the long term.
Sure today's books don't connect as well with continuity from the 80's, or those with that of the 60's.

I think that's just comics in general, but especially DC with their world reboots that really don't change a whole lot except to make things a mess for a few months. Even there, it's only confusing if you think about it too much. The books chug on like usual, and the status quo doesn't change all that much.
If you start from Infinite Crisis to now everything fits together pretty well. All I want is good stories and they have been very good.

Biofungus
12-29-2008, 12:30 AM
Actually, I think DC is confusing in that "when does story arc A take place in relation to major event B".

Mwynn
12-29-2008, 12:34 AM
Actually, I think DC is confusing in that "when does story arc A take place in relation to major event B".
Are you talking about a specific book and event?