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mikebowden
04-28-2008, 12:44 PM
I've just finished some new pages, I want to try and get more done soon so I can work on my storytelling but would appreciate a critique on these pages to help me improve. Anyway here's the art!:

http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/7329/avengers1dn8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/2066/avengers2uh0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/4581/avengers3oj4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


http://www.mike-bowden.deviantart.com/

BobRivard
04-28-2008, 02:06 PM
Nice looking pages.

Just some of the more major things that pop out to me;

There's no real establishment of what those heroes are doing on the rooftop. I'm guessing they've got their eye on that building with the boarded up window, in which case, showing that would help. Is that the case?

The situation inside the building isn't established. There's no sense of who all is in there, nor their spacial relationships to one another.

Pulling the camera back a bit to a wider shot in order to establish those relationships and show the setting (where needed) would also help break up the somewhat claustrophobic feeling a bit. All of these panels are in pretty tight and are all pretty full. That's also going to make the letterers job a bit tougher, since there's so little space.

Lastly... and this may be more of a personal thing, I think you could probably break panels a bit less. Over-using it lessens it's dynamic effect and can be distracting. I think the first panel break, with the wings covering panel 1 on page 1 works great, but having Iron's hand breaking panel 3 doesn't make any sense to me.

Other than those issues, I think the pages look really good. Your art is sexy lookin' as hell.

Nu Jin
04-28-2008, 03:11 PM
Chromo, I second on what you said.

I remember you, Mike. I haven't seen you here in a minute. :happy:

You have MAJOR potential in story-telling here. With the right script and characters that can show off your uber talent, I think I would definitely be your No#1 fan. :laugh:

Some of the shots I saw just didn't give me the impact of "wow", or that "oomph" that everybody would say every now and then. I LOVE the artwork. I just want a reason on why I love it.

Other than that dude, spectacular work. :w00t: :har:

TenGuKu
04-28-2008, 05:35 PM
amazing artwork! truly fantastic, but I have to agree with the panel breaks..aside from using them too much as chromo mentioned, they are messing up your storytelling...remember that includes proper readability of the page, not just clearly showing the action...for example..wasp in p1p2 does not seem like the small wasp she should be, but more like a hobbit sized wasp NEXT to ironman,. the reasons being: 1 you pushed ares back into the shadows, thus effectively giving wasp his space and 2. because considering that IM is panel breaking both above and below he seems to be in the same visual plane as wasp...by making her the only panel breaking figure there you could have achieved the superimposition which is normally required to have her effectively appear in a panel. p2p3 is an example of re-direction...Doc Strange's collar is making us jump panel 2 alltogether, visually at least, it leads us straight down from p1 to p3...and he's a figure in the back row of the panel..it's just a bit confusing IMO...same thing happens in p3p7 ares is once again distracting the flow of the page...Im seeeeerioussllyyy nitpicking, but thats only because the artwork is so impressive..I truly admire your ability..kudos, and best wishes! :har:

crazy8
04-29-2008, 08:23 AM
Very nics storytelling...Panel one Sentry looks alittle off too me...I agree with the others,A little too many panel breaks the first one was very good but the others take away from that first dramatic shot.I see a very JOE MAD influence. Who r your influences?I see a litlle Lenil Yu also.Great Backrounds too!
-R

InkerMAtteO
04-29-2008, 09:04 AM
Brilliant as usual!

Mind if I ink these when I get back to the states?!

MAtteO

Raff
04-29-2008, 09:56 AM
Nice stuff! :)

http://img368.imageshack.us/img368/9392/manbannerms3.jpg (http://www.drunkduck.com/Manifestations/)

Mowgli
04-29-2008, 10:10 AM
I disagree about breaking the panels. These panel breaks don't get confusing. I can still read the pages easily, so they work fine. I actually like that.

My only complaint is Iron Man's armor. It is drawn so modular. that I have trouble seeing the figure. This is especially difficult in the shot of his back. It is very hard to make out his arm from his shoulder to the hand (his left). It's also difficult making out his upper body in the first panel of page three.

Overall, I like the art a lot. I think the pages read well.

FernanDitto
04-29-2008, 02:20 PM
very well job man.Congrats

Fer!

MrGranger
04-29-2008, 04:19 PM
I like it a lot. Great work.

Miguel Marques
04-29-2008, 09:01 PM
:thumbs: :thumbs:
Only a more little bit of scenery.

Splatted35
04-29-2008, 11:51 PM
Beautiful pencils. Love panel that is shot behind Ironman, great angle. Very nice clean style with the characters.

wicked_chicken
04-29-2008, 11:56 PM
I really like these as well! Great work!

Steven Forbes
04-30-2008, 02:13 AM
I really REALLY liked these pages.

The only gripe I have about them is that they feel crowded. There isn't a lot of space for the letterer to do their job without covering a lot of the art.

Other than that, nice!

-Steven

jimlai
04-30-2008, 02:34 AM
So great :thumbs: :thumbs: :thumbs:

Randy Stone
04-30-2008, 02:50 AM
Dude, I would be in heaven inking all those feathered hatches :D

Really strong pages, great style (obviously a Joe Mad influence, but evolved beyond him in the way that someone like Dale Keown busted out from a John Byrne style)

I'm seriously impressed here!

JeffW.
04-30-2008, 09:30 AM
Even though I hate this Avengers team. (Must Wolverine be in every Marvel book?)


I really love these pages, you have an extremely cool style. Good luck bro.

mikebowden
04-30-2008, 12:45 PM
Wow! I have to say I'm actualy overwhelmed by the response!

BobRivard, Thanks for the crit. I do love panel breaking! I wish I had Iron Mans arm raised on page 1 so it didn't break the panel with the house. I'm glad it was any lower down though. I have to admit I don't love drawing backgrounds as much as I do people which is why there isn't the establishment shots. Also as it was only 3 pages I wanted to make an impact, I think if I had done a 4th page I would shown more of the interior space to set the scene. It's all a learning experience!

Nu Jin, thanks for the nice comments (I think!). I'll try and push myself more in my next work, these are already an improvement on my last pages I think.

TenGuKu, thanks for the time you spent with the crit, i totally appreciate it. Basically all the points you mentioned come down to panel breaking. I think that's something I might have to look into again. Sometimes it's hard to see the effect it will have until after the page is drawn. In the layouts I didn't even have Dr Strange or Ares breaking the panel, I just did it to make the page look more exciting.By it can interupt the flow. points taken!

crazy8, yeah I did try and tweak Sentry afterwards, I can't seem to pinpoint what's wrong with him tho! Influences are Joe Mad, Art Adams, Leinil Yu, Chris Bachalo and tons of others, too many to name!

MatteO, please feel free to ink the pages, I'm excited to see what you turn out. I think seeing my work in inks is another thing that will help me improve. I need to know what works and what doesn't when it goes from pencils to inks. Thanks for the positive feedback also!

Forby, I think you might be right about the space for speech balloons, i think next time I do layouts I'll layout the speech balloons too, I know a lot of other artists do that.

Mowgli, you picked up on something I did worry which was Iron Mans armour, I've never drawn him before and I think I should have gotten to grips with exactly how his suit is supposed to look, I'd have to say Iron Man is the hardest Marvel character to draw though! Next time I will have full references as I think I ended up changing the armour too much.

Raff,FernanDitto,MrGranger, Miguel Marques,Splatted35,wicked chicken,jimlai,Rand Stone, Jeffw...Thanks for all the nice comments guys!

pandayboss
04-30-2008, 03:25 PM
These are awesome pages. :kewl:

fletch137
04-30-2008, 05:57 PM
There's no denying these pages are beautiful and you do a great job of connecting the panels together. Unfortunately I'm lost as to exactly what's happening and had to view the pages a couple times before I even realized that half of the team was inside.

You did say you wanted to work on your storytelling, so just for the sake of understanding, what was the story you were intending to tell here? Would you mind narrating this sequence for us so we can see where you did or didn't hit your storytelling objectives?

On that same topic, have you considered collaborating with a writer to work on the storytelling? I sent you a PM offering to collaborate, but it occurs to me that it could be an open topic for general discussion and not just me trying to latch onto a very talented artist for my own gain.

mikebowden
04-30-2008, 07:31 PM
Hey Fletch137, the pages are redrawn from New Avengers 30. Basically in page 1 the Avengers team led by Iron Man are checking to see if the New Avengers are hiding out in Dr Strange's house. They're using Brother Voodoo to try and break any spells that might be hiding them. So on page 1 + 2 we see Dr Strange in his house using magic to hide the rest of the team.

page 2, panels 1+2 brother voodoo has finished his spell and is looking for signs of he avengers. page 2 last panel, brother voodoo leaves the house and Iron man is flying down to greet him.

Page 3, They have a short discussion to say nothing was found but they could still be hiding in the house as Dr Strange IS the most powerful sorcerer. Then Iron man tells the others to head back as he wants to enter the house alone.

sorry about the delay replying to your PM, these pages hae actually caught the attention of an editor so I've been asked to follow up with more pages!

BenelGermosen
04-30-2008, 10:53 PM
Mike, I don't wanna repeat everyone here, mostly because they probably know what they're talking about as oppose to me, who occasionally writes two-page Impulse scripts aping Road Runner (MeepMeep). All I got to say is that you're figure work is amazing, but they're missing something. Now, I have now idea what that something is, but there's something that's holding them back from engaging the audience completely and really standing as deep, weighted characters on a page (dunno how clear that reads). I think you're already well on your way to becoming the Next Big Thing (note the capital letters) and you don't need that much of a put to get there. In closing, keep kicking massive amounts of ass.

fletch137
04-30-2008, 11:11 PM
Hey Fletch137, the pages are redrawn from New Avengers 30.

In that case, I'm going to repeat what Forby said about speech balloons. I wasn't going to assume that there was supposed to be dialogue on these panels, but since you confirmed there is, it's something really worth paying attention to.

sorry about the delay replying to your PM, these pages hae actually caught the attention of an editor so I've been asked to follow up with more pages!

Okay, that's pretty awesome. While you're doing that, try suggesting to your new editor how cool it'd be if he swung by the writer's forum to discover one of us wordsmith types. :)

breakwater
05-02-2008, 04:06 PM
good rendering but too confusing on your layouts as stated by some earlier crtiques. It's hard to figure out what is happening in the panels sometimes. as you mention it is from an issue of new avengers. my suggestion take another look at how the artist Yu lay out that sequence. You have to think more of storytelling instead of cool shots, that will help you out alot more.oh did i mention great rendering.

Dirk Manning
05-04-2008, 05:28 PM
Stellar stuff, man!

I'll be keeping an eye out for more of your work!

SINcerely,
Dirk Manning

Drakelb
05-07-2008, 12:54 AM
These are some really nice pages. Definitely can see where storytelling and stronger script work can help convey the story better but if this is just an practice in getting panel work together, then it definitely did the job.

Rob Norton
05-07-2008, 11:29 PM
im still hit over the head with the joe mad influence... (who i like). but i like you to.

if you were drawing a book, i would want to pick it up based on the art alone.

NICE work

rob

lebeau35
05-12-2008, 03:31 PM
Wow.....very NICE work!

If u don't mind...I'd like 2 take a shot inking one of these.....?

Nick Pitarra
05-12-2008, 04:06 PM
Nice confident pencils man. I'd say pull back on some of your shots and estbalish the scenes better. Other than that...this is stuff is really great.

~nick

Mark Bertolini
05-12-2008, 04:25 PM
Looks awesome, but my only crit is the places where the panels are getting broken, they don't really need to be broken, and I feel it's a little distracting.

But it's always cool to see someone work on Ares, my new favorite Marvel character.

JJ McKool
05-13-2008, 08:13 PM
I dig the Iron Man armour, looks cool, and I think it works for the most part. Something does seem weird when their dropping down and he's got his arm extended back towards us, the shoulder "blade" thingy looks like it should be more pointed towards the reader. That's all I got.

Cyclone Ranger
05-18-2008, 01:11 PM
Great looking work but I'm afraid the left leg on the Iron man character and the warrior' s legs (don't know they're names) on Panel 1 Page 1 appear askew. If Iron man was standing as he is the knee's would be equal but the left knee is clearly below the right. The warrior's left knee is higher than the right one even though his body is turned away from us in perspective.

Seem's a bit picky but the Editor's all look out for this stuff.