View Full Version : FoJ Painting in progress
Calloway
01-12-2007, 01:29 AM
Ok, I need some tips before I go onto the next pencil layout. I had no photo ref for this. I wanted photo ref but no one I know could fit the picture in my head and the interenet had nothing similar. I want to try and get this as real looking as possible before painting. I don't want to hear crits from people who like Joe Mad and think I should draw more like that, or travis charest or whoever. I want crits from people who know what their talking about.
I've included the first rough done on my comp with a wacom and the first pencil done with pencil (duh). I wanted to try and give Fist a more real look hence the jeans (which will be grey) and gloves. So have at it, because I will take into consideration any adjustment that seems fitting and work it into the second pencils before paint.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v29/fishdirt/fojpaintingrough.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v29/fishdirt/pencil.jpg
cbgiles
01-12-2007, 01:47 AM
Dang, dats goot.
Calloway
01-12-2007, 01:59 AM
could be better. I am not very good with cloth and the jeans aren't doing it for me for some reason but I can't put a finger on it. As well as the shirt (it's supposed to be tight but not enough to see everything).
Almightychar
01-12-2007, 02:22 AM
The head is tilted too much, he looks confused like a dog hearing a strange noise. Plus, his head is not centerd on his neck, its a tad too far right ( I checked in the mirror) Also, his right arm (our left) is lower than his left, while the shoulder is higher than the left, making his arms differnt lengths. Last, his pelvis looks too narrow for his shoulder width, which might not be too bad if his legs werent so thin. they look to be the same width as his arms, but you might of wanted them thin, he is a boxer after all. Anyway, looking forward to seeing it finished! :cool:
Calloway
01-12-2007, 02:28 AM
good catch on the arms..I was about to say it was because of the hand positions being different but I looked closer...
would you believe, me the preacher of the mirror check, did not do that yet? He's actually supposed to have his head tilted back while looking down (the eyes are really getting me frustrated as well).
Yeah his legs were intentionally supposed to look like that, I am hoping the painting process will show more why.
Thanks and good eye!
Almightychar
01-12-2007, 02:42 AM
No problem :) I nitpicked it for you, lol. Oh, and Joe Mads my favorite artist, draw like him! :nyah:
Mike225
01-12-2007, 07:47 AM
The bands with the studs on them around the neck and over his shoulders are unnecessary, especially the one around the neck.
Calloway
01-12-2007, 02:11 PM
I know but I can't figure out how to make it what FoJ would wear if he were real.
Mike225
01-12-2007, 02:15 PM
He's as real as your imagination or a rainbow. :har:
Seriously, I wouldn't attribute a collar like that to "hero" so much as "S&M club goer."
If you're going for a real world spin, maybe try a turtleneck or something. Or just stick with the concept.
Calloway
01-12-2007, 02:16 PM
Still, have to have that fist of justice feel ... I wanted to keep the top in similar colors...I had thought maybe a necklace but that wouldn't really solve the color issue. Suggestions anyone?
If you're going to paint it in a realistic way i highly suggest getting some reference, even if it's bits and pieces.
Find a picture of a guy wearing jeans for the legs and waist. There's got to be wrestling photos of a similar if not exact pose. Just to get the shadows and muscles down. You can look at your own hands in a mirror to get the fingers and basic pose right.
The underdrawing is the foundation of your painting. If you skimp on it now, you're going to regret it later. Take your time, and get that underdrawing right.
Calloway
01-12-2007, 02:28 PM
Not looking for an overtly musclar type. More like a regular athelete...the face I did reference for lighting but getting the right lighting for ref is being a pain. I'm trying though.
No one said art was EASY! :p
Scaleyinx
01-12-2007, 04:22 PM
Ok Greenie, I did a quickie Photoshop cut, paste and doodle thingy for you, 'cuz I suck at describing what I'm trying to say. Hope some of this helps. :)
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/9480/pencilcopyge3.jpg
Explanation of my suggestions:
- Give some curve to the arm bands to suggest there are muscles being bound.
-Give some curve to his belt. Since it seems the vanishing line is just above his waist, I'd recommend curving the belt downward just a hint.
-Lower his crotch. Maybe not as exteme are I did in my quickie, but play around with that idea until you're satisfied.
- Give some shape and curves, and a little more bulk to the man's thighs. Also, add clothing creases,...and uh, give him a hint of a package,...ya know, nothing vulgar. Guys have muscles under those pants, and since you want him to be more athletic, we want to see that! (the light blue colored creases I added near his pelvis should not be over done. Only very slight during the painting stage so that the jeans look wore)
-You might not notice, but I shortened his neck a little, and rotated his head so that it's not so tilted. Playing around with his neck and head in Photoshop (if you have that program) might be helpful for you because you can keep adjusting and readjusting till you're satisfied.
;)
The Anti-crest
01-12-2007, 08:36 PM
Ok Greenie, I did a quickie Photoshop cut, paste and doodle thingy for you, 'cuz I suck at describing what I'm trying to say. Hope some of this helps. :)
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/9480/pencilcopyge3.jpg
Explanation of my suggestions:
- Give some curve to the arm bands to suggest there are muscles being bound.
-Give some curve to his belt. Since it seems the vanishing line is just above his waist, I'd recommend curving the belt downward just a hint.
-Lower his crotch. Maybe not as exteme are I did in my quickie, but play around with that idea until you're satisfied.
- Give some shape and curves, and a little more bulk to the man's thighs. Also, add clothing creases,...and uh, give him a hint of a package,...ya know, nothing vulgar. Guys have muscles under those pants, and since you want him to be more athletic, we want to see that! (the light blue colored creases I added near his pelvis should not be over done. Only very slight during the painting stage so that the jeans look wore)
-You might not notice, but I shortened his neck a little, and rotated his head so that it's not so tilted. Playing around with his neck and head in Photoshop (if you have that program) might be helpful for you because you can keep adjusting and readjusting till you're satisfied.
;)
I was going to suggest the same thing as far as the mans pants are concerned. They look way to straight and flat, almost as if the man has no legs at all.
Calloway
01-13-2007, 08:34 AM
No one said art was EASY! :p
seriously dano..I've studied art in school for years...I'm just rusty not incompetant.
Calloway
01-13-2007, 08:37 AM
Ok Greenie, I did a quickie Photoshop cut, paste and doodle thingy for you, 'cuz I suck at describing what I'm trying to say. Hope some of this helps. :)
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/9480/pencilcopyge3.jpg
Explanation of my suggestions:
- Give some curve to the arm bands to suggest there are muscles being bound.
-Give some curve to his belt. Since it seems the vanishing line is just above his waist, I'd recommend curving the belt downward just a hint.
-Lower his crotch. Maybe not as exteme are I did in my quickie, but play around with that idea until you're satisfied.
- Give some shape and curves, and a little more bulk to the man's thighs. Also, add clothing creases,...and uh, give him a hint of a package,...ya know, nothing vulgar. Guys have muscles under those pants, and since you want him to be more athletic, we want to see that! (the light blue colored creases I added near his pelvis should not be over done. Only very slight during the painting stage so that the jeans look wore)
-You might not notice, but I shortened his neck a little, and rotated his head so that it's not so tilted. Playing around with his neck and head in Photoshop (if you have that program) might be helpful for you because you can keep adjusting and readjusting till you're satisfied.
;)
nice. Only one bit..the arm bands were intentionally made flat...a stylistic choice for what I envisioned the final render to look like. Of course that and doing some inking are still up in the air. Same with the belt.
His legs were made intentionally skinny...again a stylistic choice (yes folks, style is what you make of it and not mistakes contrary to popular belief).
As always, taking everything here into consideration. Great ideas!
nickbachman
01-13-2007, 10:44 AM
style shouldn't take away from the piece. those particular "stylistic choices" make him look flat and chicken-legged. if you're going to chalk it up to style, then you should push that style much more and in more places, so it doesn't look like a mistake.
nickbachman
01-13-2007, 11:06 AM
also, if his head is supposed to be tilted back, you should do more things to make it look like it's actually tilting back. his ears would move down a bit (they should also be bigger anyway), the jawline would be straighter across, his hairline would be higher and the actual hairline wouldn't be visible (where his forehead meets his hair would be a line following the contour of his forehead), and you'd see less bottom lip and the same amount of upper lip as you have. right now, the only thing making it look like it's tilting back is the skewwed perspective on his nose, making him look just like this:
http://www.lonchaney.com/lc5/sr/srart/phantom.jpg
changing the things i mentioned should help it to come across better.
Calloway
01-13-2007, 02:46 PM
style shouldn't take away from the piece. those particular "stylistic choices" make him look flat and chicken-legged. if you're going to chalk it up to style, then you should push that style much more and in more places, so it doesn't look like a mistake.
I find the work of Bisley and stegman to be very cool looking and they utilize alot of flat. It makes more sense if ink is entered into the painting. I guess you'd have to be faimiliar with the works of both. Anyway, that's teetering on a no go. I have to break the habit of inking on these paintings.
Calloway
01-13-2007, 02:48 PM
How is it stylistic?
How can you tell it isn't ? It's not a finished piece. I would hope to God that the finished painting looks nothing like the drawing as far as what you see. That thing shows no depth right now (although I went in to study the face with outlines of shadow). It is only the first pencils. Gimme a chance to absorb what everyones said and go from there and bring round two into the picture.
Calloway
01-13-2007, 03:00 PM
also, if his head is supposed to be tilted back, you should do more things to make it look like it's actually tilting back. his ears would move down a bit (they should also be bigger anyway), the jawline would be straighter across, his hairline would be higher and the actual hairline wouldn't be visible (where his forehead meets his hair would be a line following the contour of his forehead), and you'd see less bottom lip and the same amount of upper lip as you have. right now, the only thing making it look like it's tilting back is the skewwed perspective on his nose, making him look just like this:
http://www.lonchaney.com/lc5/sr/srart/phantom.jpg
changing the things i mentioned should help it to come across better.
uh, no...it's not an extreme tilt. Minor things need to be changed (I dunno if you caught my self portrait earlier but that tilt). Here is more of the tilt I am going for...though masculine...
http://images.fotosearch.com/bigcomps/PHT/PHT260/PAA260000027.jpg
edit: Sorry if I am seeming blunt but I am dog tired right now. Also , even though it sounds like exscuses, people will know from the past, I do listen to everyone and what you guys have to say does effect the final piece in some way or another.
The DarkMind
01-13-2007, 03:39 PM
just an idea of what may work for the look you're going for is to lose the collar bands and put him in a hooded sweatshirt. hood up partially shadowing the face, unzipped with the fist emblem split in half and the sleeves rolled up to just above his elbows with some type of an Underarmor style athletic shirt beneath the hoodie to show some muscle definition of his chest. not overly detailed but enough to indicate some power to him. its a very classic boxer/street brawler fashion.
nickbachman
01-13-2007, 03:46 PM
uh, no...it's not an extreme tilt. Minor things need to be changed (I dunno if you caught my self portrait earlier but that tilt). Here is more of the tilt I am going for...though masculine...
http://images.fotosearch.com/bigcomps/PHT/PHT260/PAA260000027.jpg
edit: Sorry if I am seeming blunt but I am dog tired right now. Also , even though it sounds like exscuses, people will know from the past, I do listen to everyone and what you guys have to say does effect the final piece in some way or another.
then...make it better. the magic tilt is not working as is. if you wont listen to my suggestions, do your own research and find out what would make it more successful.
Calloway
01-14-2007, 06:37 PM
just an idea of what may work for the look you're going for is to lose the collar bands and put him in a hooded sweatshirt. hood up partially shadowing the face, unzipped with the fist emblem split in half and the sleeves rolled up to just above his elbows with some type of an Underarmor style athletic shirt beneath the hoodie to show some muscle definition of his chest. not overly detailed but enough to indicate some power to him. its a very classic boxer/street brawler fashion.
Actually, scale got it closer to where I was thinking of heading next. I'm losing the bandings for sure (I've realized you gotta have it one way or the other, the mix doesn't seem to look to good for the overall design of it). I'd like to keep a skin tight lycra type shirt to give the feeling that this guy is tough but maybe making the pants baggier.
Gimme a couple days and I should have the fixes done.
galmando
01-14-2007, 07:34 PM
then...make it better. the magic tilt is not working as is. if you wont listen to my suggestions, do your own research and find out what would make it more successful.
erm, didnt he just do that? i mean, he looked up a face that was tilted to get an idea of what he wants. isnt that research of a kind?
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